Ok, so after trying to get on here yesterday and finding the new system going up, I decided to stay clear for a day. This morning turning the computer on, it went into an automatic update phase (downloadng a new Windows Explorer). So now everything is different, and now that I'm on, I here that some threads are locked, and that people have been kicked off. So My Big Question is: Which threads have been Locked? And Who was Kicked off?

Just call me Nosey, By the way Rick Sight Looks Great!

Phil

New management, Rick sold it to Saeed......

Actually it was some guy named Pedro.

Don't believe everything you read.

I don't think anyone has been kicked out, but a thread that had become repugnant haa been locked. Another locked too that may have spiraled into argument over the locking of the first.

That's my take. All done and done well. It happens but not often. Now to just move forward.

looks like Rick punched Larry's (Big Stick) ticket........Blake

Larry:

Call it a career.

Goodbye.

Rick[/

It might be Larry got clubed! Pun intended. If he shot himself in the foot, I hope it's more like a suspension. I've been very critical of him latley. He dosen't know how to play well with others.

If he could maintain civility his knowledge would be a great benefit to all! Especially me.

I enjoy good clean (humorous) sarcasm
but to continuiosly "harass" others just gets so old. And then stoop to bigotry. Unbeleiveable!

If this is how he's gonna continue to act than I'll be glad if he's gone!!!!

Might be he's fishing or tracking wolves. That would be a great way to enjoy the weekend!! CD

Checked out the user/member list and he is still on there.


Nail

I remember him from way back at "Shooters" always seemed real helpfull, and most of all respectfull to others. He seemed to change over the last few years. I personaly don't care for Premadona's of any kind, that being said he was a wealth of knowledge and experiance. It's a shame!

Phil

I just checked it too. Didn't find him. At least we know he's in Paradise.

He's listed on the "User List" but hasn't posted lately.

GK

list

Well, I hope the rumors of his demise are greatly exagerated.

Looks like Stick's last post here was Friday night at 9 PM.

Rick said this at 10:35 PM the same night,after Stick had made two racial slurs in two different threads (again)-

Larry:

Call it a career.

Goodbye.

Rick

I'd say it's a good chance he's gone.Kind of sad-during the reboot of the site,I checked my old posts and it pulled up some of my very first from around '02,most of which Stick posted on.He was very whitty,smart,helpful and nice.

Ego will do strange things to folks.....

WB.

Knitting circle........

Oh the Drama.........

Better be glad that I'm not owner/moderator of this board, I would have slammed the lock on several threads that degenerated into stupid crap and booted half a dozen jerks out of here, LONG before Mr. Rick Bin reached the reaction point. This site is as free a site as there is on the internet, and some of you guys are making things very uncomfortable for Rick. Very unappreciative, after being provided with a free and excellent quality forum to talk about hunting stuff. I'm just a bit player here, with no crop of expensive hunting rifles and African/Alaskan adventure to talk about, but I have enjoyed reading the Campfire for years, with the exception of a small handful of domineering ego driven chumps who try to take over ever thread so that they could downgrade and insult other people and their hunting gear. I had to go read the "TKD" thread to see what had really happened. Unbelievable. Proof of what I had already judged to be anyways. It's a disgusting shame that Rick was forced to have to deal with such garbage.

Well, I hope Stick will still be around...
I have PMed him several times about some questions on some stuff, and he was prompt about getting back with me and had some good advice to share.
I realize that he rubs some folks the wrong way, but that is no reason not to be included. This is after all a "forum".

Guy's it looks like Big Stick is history and I for one feel like the campfire will be lesser without him. He would call a spade a spade and I am sure that he walked the walk and talked the talk. Getting nuked for being offensive is pure BS, we are afforded an IGNORE THIS USER button........Blake

I have to say that if he's been canned, I'm going to miss him. I found him abrasive, rude and arrogant quite often ... but I found him to be much more helpful and informative on a regular basis, than he ever was a jerk. I got tons of great advice from him, both in threads and in PM's ... and never had a problem dealing with him.

Now, I can't know what might have transpired personally between Rick and Larry before Rick decided to pull the plug ... Maybe Rick asked Larry to chill out at least once, if not more ... maybe there was no warning whatsoever ... either way, I don't know, so I can't really comment on whether or not it was "BS" that Larry is no longer welcome here ...

I simply hope, that if there's a chance that he can come back, that he'll be happy to do so, and that he will ... It's tough to lose someone that is basically a walking encyclopedia of all things firearms ...

Remember don't shoot the messenger

O.K fellas here the scoop.I take no joy in telling you guys this as I considered Stick a good dude but I pmed Rick and Yes Stick was cancelled.

Rick also wanted to express he takes no joy in it either but explained he is running a business and racial comments can't be tolerated and also wishes he would of stopped the thread earlier.
Also stuff like what happened could have gottin his site shut down.It's a no win situation all around.

Sorry to all

Yours Truly
Mike

ALSO WILL ADD RICK THINKS THE WHOLE THING SUCKS....ALL AROUND

Like I said if he shot himself in the foot. I hope it's a suspension. I wonder how some of the advertisers on this site would feel about the way he's been carring on?

For what it's worth (and what you paid for it), my feelings on Larry and some others that need no introduction won't change; I have no respect whatsoever for them or any man who judges others based on race, color or creed. That said, provided he agrees to keep his damned racist attitudes to himself, would vote to keep him on, though I realize it's not subject to one.

LH

Nothing personal happened between me and Larry. In fact, if I ever have the chance to buy him a drink or do him a service, I will gladly do it.

The thing about being a webmaster is that no matter what you do or how you do it, you always split the crowd.

To all of you who have been PMing me for months at every Larry wisecrack, let me just say that the guy contributed a LOT to this site, especially in the early years, but even recently. There was a time when the line of newbies into Larry's PM box asking advice on building rifles, INCLUDING ME, was long. Also, what Blake says about Larry being a straight shooter, is wholly true in my experience. Larry was an assett. I am not a happy camper.

To all of you who will defend him and overlook the nature of his posting recently, and of the TKD thread especially, then I submit you aren't being honest about the point we reached.

Freedom of speech has limits. Here, and everywhere. Someone has to draw the line here, and that someone, for better or for worse, is me. I drew that line, in a clear manner. I didn't draw it at Remingtons or Leupolds or someone hurt my feelers or something petty.

I drew it at continued, deliberate, overt racism. I should have never, ever tolerated it for the one day I did. That was a bad, bad mistake on my part, and to those who were offended, I apologize for not acting more quickly. That was a serious lapse of judgment on my part. Truth is, I didn't WANT to ban Larry.

The ironic thing is that now, after resisting pretty serious calls over the last 18 months to two years to nuke him (can I have a show of hands?), I'm going to be accused by some of being a happy trigger.

Guys, I had no other real move. Larry put me in a very difficult position.

He pushed too far.

Rick

Ihonda, drop it, it's done, why bring it up, Stick had a lot of knowledge, i will admit her rubbed people wrong sometimes, but chill out. Crap, Happy I have armor plating for skin, shiet just rolls of my back like water on a Duck. Les

Rick you did what you had to do, fully understand, still sucks though.

I was trying to be a good guy and had my hand up to keep your buddy on here in the spirit of the site, but I guess you missed that. No biggie. Done deal.

No I caught that, but it's over, why even bring it up anymore. Yeah, Stick could grate, but hell, So can I, but I try not to cross that line. Nothing against ya Ihonda. Les

Rick- I'm sorry you were put in a terrible position. Thanks for doing the right thing, however hard & unpleasant.

I came here a couple of months ago looking for a present for my husband and didn't think I would stay, but here I am. Being a woman, I didn't think I would be welcomed, but I was. You have a great site. It's nice to have the friendly tone back in it- it's very endearing.

Thanks too for working so hard on getting the site updated and up & going again so no one dies from withdrawl. I hope you are able to catch up on your sleep this week. Tell the boss you'll be coming in late tomorrow!

Thank you!

The ironic thing is that now, after resisting pretty serious calls over the last 18 months to two years to nuke him (can I have a show of hands?), I'm going to be accused by some of being a happy trigger.

Guys, I had no other real move. Larry put me in a very difficult position.

He pushed too far.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------





Is this in regards to locking a thread, or has Stick been shown the door?

Both

'Bout a year ago, in a thread I started about my mother's drug problem...Stick said something that has stuck with me. He said "Even family can be cull." I acknowleged him....cuz he was, indeed, right.

I have taken more than my share of insults, name-calling, chit slinging from the man....but I always read his rifle/hunting posts....and gleaned what I could from him. He was an asset to this board....and he was/is something to behold, when it comes to cutting through the chit...and more than a few will miss reading those posts.

Mr. Bin did what he had to do....not what he wanted to do. A bold move, on his part, and I don't envy him.

I won't miss his harshness....or his rants.....but I can fully understand missing what he, without all the other crap, brought to this board. Doubt I am alone.

But, when the dust settled, and enough was enough...."even family can be cull".

Peace out,
HoundGirl

I've talked with Stick for almost 5 years now, since I first joined here in '02.Despite what you see here on the forum, I don't recall us ever having many disagreements in our PM's.

I learned a lot in those early discussions, and really looked forward to getting Larry's opinion on different things. But over the years, I watched his ego grow and grow as this site grew and he became considered a "guru". It seemed that he became a hero in his own mind, and he just became arrogant. The nice, helpful guy slowly disappeared and was replaced by someone else.

Rick did the right thing. If you used that kind of language at work, or in a business you were frequenting (which this is), you would be asked to leave. Larry just did not let it slip once. He did not just let loose in one thread .He dropped racial slurs in three threads (that I saw) within a day or two, and on top of that, brought his kids into it with pictures. He pushed "acceptable conduct" right out the window.

There has to be a line folks. If that kind of stuff is allowed, then what else?

I'll miss butting heads with the Big Stick of today, but I'd rather have back the nice, friendly ,helpful Larry I first met in '02.

WB.

I for one won't miss him at all.Good riddance.I have been known to raise a few hackles myself but to do it almost automatically and with no regard for the other is ..........................

One down and one more to go...............

I can only hope...............

Sorry for the dots but I am feeling very sarcastic.

OK, for some reason the new board took me straight to page two of the thread.

Well it is too bad, but I'm betting Rick wasn't quick on the trigger. IMHO Stick doesn't seem the type to conform to what others think right & wrong, and I think maybe up in the bush of AK a man can let his work ethic do the talking, but the trouble is the 24hr is read everywhere & Rick has no choice but to consider that...

Maybe in the future something will be worked out.

I personally ain't real crazy over the PC freaking world we inhabit.

Ain't faulting Rick Bin, he's got advertisers to think of etc.


But I will tell you this, I bought more stuff from Rick Bin on Stick's advice than I ever would have if not for his input. I didn't or haven't bought a lot and not saying I won't buy more from Rick, just stating facts for what they were in my experience. The guy was downright helpful to me in both PM's and phone calls, though I don't always endorse his style of banter.

But I do have a question for you folks, can anyone give me a count on how many times we heard jokes, both delivered in good humor and in mean spirit about Stick's height or lack thereof. (grin)

Where's Randy Newman when you need him? Short people got no reason to live..........

We all got our crosses to bear, some just got thicker skin and bear it better than others IMO.

How long before it's PC to not taunt short, fat, bald, lazy you name it folks?

My opinion and my opinion only, I ain't lived in lhonda's skin nor he mine. But I will say what I thought started to be a harmless off the cuff remark was turned into a whole nuther gig, by typical crybaby crap.

Then there was the piling on by folks that had been previously wounded in exchanges.

As said, no beef with Rick, it's his house and he's got run it as he sees fit. But it's a shame it came to this IMO. YMMV

WCB you gotta point, Stick can/could be his own worst enemy, the pics of the kids were probably over the top for many.

It ain't comedy central, it's the campfire.

Still I'll miss the Gnome. (I'd post pics of my kids now cause they're short, but never have got the hang of pic posting, grin)

HG; Very well said. +1

And then there was none...

twas a good post HG, have to agree with your assesment and what Rick says that it wasn't what he wanted to do.

You gonna have to pick up the slack now Steelhead. (grin)

If the day comes when hateful, racist words the likes of which got tossed around here are accepted as being harmless by the masses, no matter what group they're directed at, I'll hang my head in shame as an American.

Edit: And by the way, I'm not sure if your 'crybaby' comment was directed at me specifically or not, but you're welcome to ask Rick if he got any whining, complaining or plea from me asking him to step in or stop the thread, ban anyone--or contact him in any way, for that matter. I fight my own battles, thank you very much.

I'll leave aside the question of whether Stick was acting w/ malicious intent. He could very well have been.

I'd just like to point out that part of what has been seen as the genius of Lenny Bruce is that the very suppression of these words is what keeps them harmful. Its an odd way of looking at it, but its probably true unless you can make a strong argument that the words incite action. The SPLC has been successful in making this case, at least once that I'm aware of.

"It's the suppression of the word that gives it the power, the violence, the viciousness." Lenny Bruce

Damn... a goodly number of my relatives and the guys I grew up with would be tossed off of here in a heartbeat. I guess I see a disjunct between what a guy says, and what he would do when the chips are down.

Many of the guys I know and/or am related to who spout off all sorts of crap would be equally quick to defend to the death a friend of theirs of ANY persuation.

OTOH I've known folks who spout off all sorts of PC platitudes but who would leave ya in the lurch in a heartbeat were it their own hide at risk.

I'm guessing that there were warning PM's sent and disregarded before Stick got pulled. Damn... I hate to see anyone get kicked off.

Birdwatcher

I think Rick did the right thing. Racial slurs have no righteous place in America. Remember that in Vietnam, combat platoons were integrated for the first time in history. Our returning combat vets from the middle east who are trying to put their lives back together, do not need to read racial slurs about themselves on this website. If they are trying to get back into shooting sports they should be welcomed. If Chinese American vets are good enough to fight and die for America they are good enough to be treated fairly. Stick had it coming.

No sale on the metaphysical/philosophical justification here. But as I'm done with the debate aspect of it, I guess it boils down simply to what you believe in, and what you feel is right and wrong...

1. Rick owns and runs the site.

2. Rick runs this site more respectfully and tolerantly than just about any other board on the net.

3. Rick really HATES to drop the hammer.

4. This is probably THE largest site of its kind on the net, therefore it WILL have its dustups.

5. All the Peeing & Moaning is a waste of his bandwidth the HE pays for, let it die.

6. Hell, I stepped on my d.... uh tongue not all that long ago and he was big enough to let me live on here 'cause I fessed up and apologised. Rick is a CLASS act and I will never question his actions. He has more than proven that he has the patience of Job & the wisdom of Solomon when it comes to running a board.

Kudo's Rickmeister for running the best joint on the net, even if you do have to rearrange the furniture every so often.

The business decision was clearly within reason. That doesn't change the fact that we all lost a valued asset to the site as a whole, and it's a shame, which is why I'm sure Rick hates what he had to do. It seems kinda like politics lately, the more "civilized" we get, the worse off we are. This AIN'T the "good old days".

If Stick was repeatedly warned and continued to disregard Rick's wishes, then I guess he made his own bed. I could go on and on here about chit but I won't. To sum it up, I think the whole thing sucks heavily, but don't blame anyone........

Forgot to add, anyone that PM'ed Rick beggin' him to axe Stick or anyone else is a big puzzy in my eyes...............

The type of peron that goes crying to mommy...probably won't admit it.

The whole thing sucks dick.Here's a thing of beauty.

Agree 100%, to both posts, not playing the blame game here. Rick made a clear but still tough call. It sucks all the way around. PM's crying to Rick IS a puzzy move.

+1
I would never, ever PM Rick asking him to axe anyone. Rick has a job to do, and petty PM's asking him to axe someone just takes his valuale time that he could be spending doing something for the betterment of the Forum.
Rick is an EXCEPTIONAL human being. He's more than capable of sorting out problems and issues with the Forum, without petty bickering, and a barrage of PM's asking him to axe someone. Rick does not need my input for decision making. Rick is like my oldest son, who is also gifted intellectually. They're the same age.
Stick was an exceptional human being also; a guy who contributed tons to my life and to the lives of others here. But, because you are an exceptional human being doesn't grant you immunity from crossing a line where you destroy others.
I liked Sitck very much, and protected him in my postings when others bashed him. But, you don't get a free pass when you kill off someone, no matter how bright you are, or how much good you have contributed in the PAST. The past is history when a situation like this arises. Rick, as he always does in his dealings, did the correct thing by letting Stick go. Even though Stick won't be visiting here, I consider him as one of my sons, who I have an outstanding relationship with. I'll miss his insights, but life will go on.
Hopefully Stick will grow from this fiasco, and not resort to being bitter. I loved Stick like I do my own sons, who are the same age as Stick, and who are hunting and shooting gurus in their own right. His kids are like my grandkids.
Stick, Bon Voyage. I'll be in touch..

Don

I've noticed Stick's devolution over the past couple years and was wondering when something might happen.

An unchecked ego tends to run amok as it feels it has no limits. The kindest thing would have been to "take him aside" sometime back and perhaps, in doing so, avoided the recent ugliness.

Hound Girl...great post.

I like and respect Stick very very much.Also the only reason I put my post up was to tell the good folks here what happened.Also the taddle tales through pm's is a chicken way to do it.Wish the whole darn mess didn't happen..That's all I can say........

I'll also miss "Drunkenhotchickaholic"..

Don

Good job. I'm sorry he was your friend, but he forced your hand. Big Stick was literally tearing up your site. Making a couple of offhand remarks about groups of people could be ignored. But in-your-face racial slurs to individuals who are also members here and who did nothing (that I could see) to merit being insulted, simply cannot be left alone. Thanks for being fair.

Wow ain't that the truth! I've known Larry a long time now, well over ten years. This was a slow transformation. It began with his bizzaro statements, rude comments, arrogent posts. He migrated from a really great guy with more experience in a year of hunting, then most folks have in a lifetime. Not only that but the willingness to politely share it with anyone who asked.

In those early "Big Stick" days he wrote things that made sense and you could follow along with. I'm not sure if the later posts were a means of hiding typo's, grammer, or spelling issues but I felt at times I needed captions, or an interpreter to follow along with them. His text degraded into some kind of blend between hillbilly jibrish and engineering specific techno babble.

It became so silly at times I left a post of his before reading completely through it. Several guys who are his frineds here and mine also spoke about his very strange behaviour over the last couple years regarding this wierd change in writing style. That in itself was never an issue to cause trouble, but it seemed it was changing over at about the same time he was beginnging to really pick on people with opinions other then his own.

I'll give Larry this much, he has a lot of experience in shooting and a whole lot of dead critters to his credit. Probably one of the top people in this persuit in the world today. It's a shame he seemed to collapse here, but I'll also say that it might be in the best interest for his life. I Post here way more then I should. I have a life outside this website and my business. Anyone with over 26,000 posts on just this one site alone, has gotta have some issues with how they spend their time! I can't imagine sitting here one second more then I do, and I have only one little boy, and my wife to share time with. Add in household responsibilities, a Job not to mention actually doing the hunting fishing and other outdoor adventures. How can a guy spend that much time on all these internet sites and still function with the family, or life in general?

I think this place actually made him crazy with the non-sense that was posted from time to time. It's as if it became an addiction in his life. He was totally sucked into this Hunting chat forum crap. When you spend that many hours a day reading and posting on these forums I think anyone would snap and start going crazy.

I think Chehea nailed the cause of Larry's change in another thread...

Don

I would only add that we don't know that someone actually PM'd Rick about wanting Stick gone. I'll have to admit, after several rounds of really aweful talk I was tempted myself- not to ask him to get gone, but to ask that he be toned down. (I didn't, but I was very upset-my children are half Asian.) My only point being that you didn't need a PM to notice the brawl. Taking up several pages on a prevalent thread it was pretty tough to miss. And I doubt Rick would ax anyone at the request of another anyway. If we are to say the guns don't kill people, people do, then I think it follows that Stick caused his own demise.
Being new here, I'm sorry I didn't get to see Stick the Teacher. Sounds like he was something to behold.

My problem with the situation is this, most if not all here are adults as such we have the ability to read and not read the topics of our chosing. If you do not agree with someone, then use the " IGNORE THIS USER" button and live happily ever after. What pisses me off is that those who spoke out against Stick the most had this option, if you did not like what the man said then you did not have to read it, getting booted for speaking your mind is pathetic no matter how others take it.......Blake

Some of the stuff that was said in that thread was just plain raccial, granted, there was a few times I laughed right along with it but there was a point where it got ugly and that's when it should have ended. Personally, I thought Stick was a good guy and helped a ton of people on this site, including myself. Putting someone on ingore doesn't make the thread go away and anyone who happened to come here for the first time and see that thread would probably not think to highly of this site and I'm sure that played a part in Rick's decision making process. Like him or not, he could make you laugh like a madman or really get under your skin but he pulled no punches and spoke his mind, got to admire that in a man. It won't be the same around here without him......

I remember him from "Shooters" also, and have noticed the gradual change for the worse. I'll miss his knowledge, and half his humor.
I was surprised at some of the stuff he was getting away with.
It sucks, but Rick did the right thing.

Wish I would have saved his email addy.

Rick has said this is a family site with kids on board. If we can't have bouncing boobs in avatars then why in the world would he allow blatant racism.

I think JJ nailed it. Past deeds don't excuse current behavior.

Rick, et al,

Not that my agreement or disagreement with your move means beans, but here goes...

Personally I disagree with banning Larry. And I say that not liking too much he had to say in the way of opinions here in the fire forum. His tastes in guns didn't match mine either, but I know he knew his stuff on them too. And again thats all just different tastes. I had some PM conversations with him when some thread on religion got nasty. I found him to be a man that professed not to be a Christian, for which I can only say I wish that weren't true, but yet a man that would tell you that calmly and not try to argue it with you if you didn't push it with him...he was forthcoming, and generally polite and respectful to me... and to all unless you played in to his hand and took the many baits he left around the fire, some of which I agree were abrasive and/or off color. Ultimately, it was his offbeat sense of humor that made him love to poke fun and bait others on taboo subjects that cost him...other than that he was as others here have said...generally knowledgable, and a decent guy to converse with.

Freedom of speech? That only applies to government censorship...period. This is Rick's site, and his business...he can nuke anyone or any topic he pleases, for any reason, without warning or explination. Bottom line...its Rick's business decision and I can't argue with that.

Rick, some (NOT ALL) were too easily offended by Larry. Some had right and cause to be offended. I'd also say you excercised great patience and restraint, and I know it was a last resort, and you did what you had to do. The ignore button is easy to operate y'all.

JMO, YMMV!

Bummer.........

I for one learnt a bunch from Stick, even if he was a bit of a hard read from time to time.

I think this is spot-on ... and well said at that ...

If we're throwing our hats into the ring concerning whether or not we'd like to have Larry as a member here, I will go on record saying I wish he'd not been shown the door. Now, do I think he crossed the line with his racism/bigotry stuff that he recently posted ... Yes, I do ... but I'd also like to think that he was just going over the top, and not one who truly wishes to demean an entire group of people due to race or religion ... but then again, I can't (and won't) speak for anyone but me ...

Oddly enough, even if Rick were to extend a "welcome back" invitation to Larry, I doubt if he'd accept. He just never came off to me as one that would want back in after what's transpired...

I really wish that none of this ever went so far, and that all this had never happened. I would imagine that for some, this is truly a bitter-sweet circumstance. Personally, (and for most here I can only assume) that this is an almost total loss ...

He's gone folks.Let's just drop it.

WB.

i do not believe it was stick's ego growing. it was something else growing. cheaha and i have our theory. 13,000 enablers are too much of a good thing.
i will continue to pray for him and his ...
(elipses are a pun, for those in the know ...)
rick, i know it was WAY difficult for you.
mercy.

With regard as to what transpired I think this says it all.

What are the rules of conduct for the forum?
Registration as a user implies acceptance of the following terms and conditions:
- Participants shall not post any material that is likely to cause offence, protected by copyright, trademark or other proprietary right - without the express permission of the owner of such copyright - or that contains personal contact information, phone numbers or addresses.
- Participants may not use the forums to post or transmit advertisements or commercial solicitations of any kind.
- The forum Administrators and Moderators have the right to edit, censor, delete or otherwise modify any posted message.
- This web site does not verify or guarantee the accuracy of the material posted to the forums or bear any responsibility for any loss, damage, or other liabilities caused by any posted message.

Rick has shown unbelievable restraint in enforcing the forum rules of conduct IMO. I am very sorry about what happened to Stick. He is an extremely knowledgeable outdoorsman and his knowledge and experience will be sorely missed.

Nice job Rick in a tough situation.

I am sorry the guy won't be around. He had a lot of "real world" knowledge to share, which I always appreciated, regardless of his strong opinions and blunt statements. When I saw the TKD thread, it was like watching a train wreck and I knew that the outcome was going to be bad. The thread kind of made me sick to my stomach. It's a shame that things went that far, a bad deal all around.

dang, had no idea.... well stick, if your readin' this you will be missed.. cant speak for you or rick or whoever but you will be missed...

mall ninja, i got that saved on my desktop

adios amigo....

woofer

What are the rules of conduct for the forum?
Registration as a user implies acceptance of the following terms and conditions:
- Participants shall not post any material that is likely to cause offence,

What causes offense to some is merely words to others........Blake

And therein lies the problem.....

True. But in this case what causes offence is up to Rick to decide. It's his place, Rick's American Cafe Campfire (Like my use of the new strike through feature?

Not being a cyber-psychiatrist, I can't explain what happened.
But I do know it's going to be different around here and most don't know how different yet.
This is not a comment against Rick, it's about unintended consequences.
t

Painless,
This is Rick's house.There is no "free speach" here,just as there is no "free speach" in YOUR house-if you don't like what someone says in your house,you give them the boot.

There's only one person to blame here,and it's Stick.He would have been gone long ago,on any other board.If Rick had let this go,then what would have happened next?

WB.

I would rather sit at a real campfire, and enjoy shooting the real $hit with him and listening to the f-bombs and racial slurs and whatnot�because that�s real life and not some watered down politically correct horse pi$$. That�s the virtual world for ya�gotta please the puzzies and sometimes the players have to pay the price.

You can bet Rick agonized over this.
He never takes banning lightly. Never.
Fox and some others were just trolls and grenade throwers and Rick went out of his way to allow them to stay.
How much harder was the decision when it was someone who had positively contributed so much in the past.

You can also bet Rick sent Stick some PM's before it came to that.

In this new server transition I , like most of you, got all of my old PM's back from years ago.
Some are from Stick, answering some questions in a short but helpfully manner giving me his expert information and good wishes.

I read the posts of the last week and one would not believe they were written by the same person.
I am afraid that perhaps they were not. Stick changed.

Sadly he was acting like a mean drunk. As if he wanted to leave with a bang.

Knowing Rick he was given every opportunity to step back from the edge. I am sorry he did not take it.
I will miss you stick, but you volunteered for this.

Lewis

Larry's downward spiral has been painful to see, the last couple years. As Fish said, far to many enablers though the choice was his.

I was at the old Shooters Site when Larry first appeared, in fact, I was one of the very few posters who would even talk to him without contempt.He went from an extremely knowledgeable, helpful poster to a raving sociopath in latter years. Pride and the bottle has taken it's toll. Sad to see a shooter fall. Here's hoping he recieves some help...

The majority of the posts in this thread,point to why this happened in the first place.

"Stick didn't do anything wrong!"

When you have your own fan club,and have to please them on a daily basis,I guess it can get to you.........

I suspect if someone like Pugs (for example),who is just a good All-American poster,had used this kind of language and got banned,no one would have cared.No tears would have been shed.There would have been one thread that said "Good job Rick!" and that would be the end of the discussion.

But because Stick offered up good advice,and was a constant source of entertainment,that gives him a pass on bad behavior for many of you.

Kind of like how the Democrats and the press give the Kennedy's a pass every time they step in it........

We will have to hear about this crap for years........

WB.

Dude...some of the theorizing happening here is extremely funny. When's Dr. Phil gonna chime in?

I wish him all the luck in the world,but if he uses the same language/attitude he did here in the last 6 months,his partners won't stick with him for more than a month or so.

No business wants anything to do with that crap.

WB.

I'm sure your thoughts carry a lot of weight with him....

WCB,
Your just glad he's gone because he got the better of you so many times. Anyone that doesn't see that is blind! I met the guy and let me tell you he is a crack up and what was in the TKD thread was Bait and several hookups were set. Although some of the comments were a bit over the top, that guy has a heart of gold. I do not believe that he has ability to be a racist. The terms he used were to stir the pot and you fell for it. He could have had someone poking fun at white guys and he would think it just as funny. I can't speak for him but I'm guessing he was laughin the whole way through the thread. This world we live in is so PC and so many feel the need to be offended over words. I believe the term "Lightin up" was used several times through the TKD thread. I hope he can be invited back and asked to play nice in the sandbox with the other kids.

My .02

The top two things I liked most about this site was being able to be uncensored and the good prices you could get on Leupies. You see racist stuff in top selling uncensored movies everyday and they still make millions. Seems like another win for liberals and you can buy scopes for the same price at any local store now. Any campfire I've been around has moderated itself with the people around it.

When are you dying?

Why would I be glad he's gone?!?!I had more fun butting heads with him on here than anything else.The board will be much more dull,now that he's gone.....

And FWIW,I think I got the better of him in our final exchange,though I had a serious advantage (the only time I'll ever have that)....

WB.

I'm just hoping I outlast you.....

WB.

Last I saw you said 1 year. You just might outlast me, but I'll have a hell of a lot more fun in the mean time.......

Ass cancer?

I've said it before and I'll say it again - if Stick wrote a book I'd be the first to sign up for an autographed copy. I enjoyed his offhanded remarks and sarcasm - too many, it seems, took him too seriously in that regard. Far as I could tell he was illustrating his point in the continued remarks - that point being that some are a bit uncomfortable in their own skin. Glad I didn't have to make the choice to boot him.

Bro Dave, can you pm me the name of his site, i'd like to check it out myself....

I wish Stick the best, I think most of his banter was meant in jest. IMO people take things way too seriously nowadays.

S'head,
Nope,never said one year.I think I'll make it a lot longer than that.Considering my life has nothing to do with this thread,and is none of your business,why did you bring it up?

375matt,
Funny,but you'd have to ask S'head about that.He's the one into ass play.

Nice try at changing the topic folks.........

WB.

Glad to see you are firmly on both sides of this issue, Tim.
t

Can't wait to hear how many folks tune in for WCB wisdom and advice. Make sure your inbox is cleaned out, I can see the flood of rifle/scope/Alaska questions coming your way, TFF.

Translation: "I just want this to be over because I played a big part in the TKD thread."

Dude you read like a Book!

I gotta catch the bus, back online in a day or two....you boys play nice....

Leading medical journals state the leading cause is spending large amounts of time with your shorts jammed up your arse while stuffed in a locker.

SOOOO....
Stick is gone and Rick got some PM's calling for
his head....Too bad on both things,for many reasons...
I'll say this. If you are thin skinned,the internet
ain't a place for you!I understand that this is a family
site and folks rub together wrong sometimes...But PM'ing
Rick and calling for him to be banned is chickensh*t!!!
There is someone else that was involved in that mess
that should probably leave as well....

You lost me,t!
I think people took Stick's joking around too seriously. If they didn't he would still be here, I wish he was still here...

Wouldn't hold my breath cause "victims" are always innocent.

Well,I can see Stick getting his ass drop kicked out the door,hurt the feelers of the Alaska crew,and they're holding lil ole me responsible.

I'm honored ya'll feel that way.Will ya'll mail me a trophy or something?Maybe in the shape of a steaming pile of BS?

Well,it's been fun ladies,but some of us actually have work to do.....I'll be back tonight to see how you're doing without your fearless leader.

WB.

Post deleted by RickBin

Post deleted by RickBin

WTF happened there......?

Right on!!!!
Couldn't agree more.

Don

Sooo
The short bus is outside waiting to pick you up?

Ain't that the truth...

Man, what we need now is a whole thread dedicated to MPAJ.

BMT

You can say that again

Looks like you hit the button 3 times...

Careful, he'll start cryin'...again.

Nope...

Hit the submit once, it went into slooow mode and three copies popped up....

I think the forum needs some Imodium, the feces is already over my boot tops!

Good God folks you make me feel like I fell down the rabbit's hole.

Stick was an asset to this site, cannot say the same for all the people that wanted him banned.

How about an MPAJ forum? ... (grin)

careful....wouldn't want to offend the monkeys

Well, looks like all the usual suspects are starting to pile in. Hope my bud brings the bourbon soon. Better mount this new press first..........

WAY toooooo phreakin' phunny ... and unfortunately, way too true in this wonderful age of pc hell ...

The bad news is you lose a lion. The worse news is you still have hyenas and jackals.

I am not blaming anyone, it's just an observation.

t

We better all get our Field & Stream subscriptions renewed.

I wouldn't mind a shot across the bow of the disrespectful(to our host) people who constantly misspell curse words trying to circumvent the word blocker!

This is a family site, the rules are no cussing or they wouldn't get blocked to start with, we all know you are big boys so you don't have to curse to try to prove it, and it shows a lack of respect for Rick.

I used to cuss like the worst of them and eventually found myself doing it in front of women and children..That's when I knew it was time for a change of heart on the issue.

Rant mode off.

Mike

Better hurry and PM Rick so you can get them banned!

We all have a chink in our armor, some know how to exploit it more and some aren't aware of it.

There are no perfect people, just perfect intentions.

I'm thinking Stick has already moved on and isn't cryin his beer or Crown, maybe it's time we did the same....

IIRC Rick did ask how everyone felt about his actions............

Doesn't make sense for people going into the attack mode. Larry stepped over the line (on more than one occasion) and Rick had no choice. Stimulating conversation by being controversial is one thing, I can understand Rick taking action when Larry engaged in ethnic slurs.

Place isn't gonna be the same with Larry gone. I didn't have a problem looking past some of his insults. I can also say I've enjoyed many of his post once I learned how to read Sticklish. I'll keep up with has antics on another site he frequents

Heck, if he promises to behave bring him back on probation or something

I hate to see this happen. I've known BS since Shooters and I've learned more from him than any other. He was always willing to answer questions and help you with a project. He helped make this site what it is today and it will be less with out his knowledge and expertise. It's a shame he became so offensive in some of his more recent posts.

I believe Rick did what he felt he had to do, I'm sure he really didn't want to do it, and I'd bet there was much effort to prevent it.

It's just a sad affair all around.

Never PM'd Rick for anything but questions or commerce. Don't care much for banning anybody either. I do care if the best site on the web gets drug into the gutter by a few idjits!!

Just in this thread alone there are several examples of what I describe! I won't name names but have met a couple and like them just fine and would be more then happy to meet the rest, but there is a time and a place for certain things and these forums ain't the place for them.

I posted a picture a long time ago that was offensive and Waders called me out on it and I respect him for it...He used to look on with his child in his lap and they had no business seeing what I posted, curse words fall into the same catagory..

Mike

Any of you guys ever here of Archie Bunker ?

This crowd is what's going downhill, too many Californians and/or Californian wannabes. I hope when a guy gets banned he has the option of having everything he ever typed into this site erased too...

Rick, If you are reading, can a guy opt out of here with all posts erased ? I know this is a business venture, so maybe there is a price tag on taking posts off line ?

Man it is going to be a long time till the next hunting season and thing calm down again. You gentlemen need to relax and have drink or something. Rick has allways been nothing but fair to everyone. If anything he has let treads go long past the time they should have been axed in an effort to keep a hands off position. If stick got whacked I am sure it was for a good reason.tom

tom, which is it, do people need to drink, or is drinking bad for people and the internet ?

Of course there's free speech here. You just have to be civil when you speak and attack the message, not the messenger when you disagree.

I received several PM's today relating to this topic which will remain private, of course, save for one I had with DJMBOW who has not precluded my addressing of the substance of our communications. I was going to stay out of the fray, but after reading toltecgriz, bart185's and a couple other posts, combined with the PM's, I thought I would toss this out for consideration. First, I respect Mr Bin greatly as he is a fine and astute businessman who had to make an extremely tough business decision based upon the masses rather than the few. Having said that, I have the greatest respect for Stick as well and he will be sorely missed until such time as he may find his way back here. This is Rick's football and when he leaves, the ballgame's over. That's the short and simple of that.

My issue lies mainly into what I perceive as a subliminal type censorship that may be milling around and not all the players know the game rules, myself included. As to djmbow, here is a nutshell of his concerns, well founded or not I don't know, but perhaps an understanding can be gained from it by all.


djmbow personally confided in me that one of the reasons that he had to leave the Campfire was that he felt that he was no longer free to express his opinions here.

Here's is what he was trying to say on the Kutenay post, but got short-stopped when the thread got locked for reasons perceived but not actually known.

I may not agree with his position, but I believe he should have been given the opportunity to have expressed it . I don't believe the lock was b/c of his particular post but b/c of the overall dynamics related to it all.


djmbow's post:

The first thing I want to say here is that although I don't agree with the call, Rick is the REFEREE here and he certainly has the RIGHT and the RESPONSIBILITY to call them as he sees them.

Now that is out of the way, I have a question which (although not required) I was hoping someone here could answer somewhat intelligently.

Here goes:

While I can certainly understand how and why people can become offended by another persons remarks here (since it has certainly happened to me on more than one occasion), I cannot for the life of me understand why someone would wish to deny them the opportunity to say it?

Maybe I'm mistaken, but this is still a Forum I believe, which is defined by Webster to be: "a medium (as a newspaper) of open discussion or expression of ideas."

Doesn't it necessarily follow that like any other "medium", if one is offended by it or disinterested in the subject matter they can and often do choose to go elsewhere?

Certainly with the myriad of choices Rick has so graciously provided on the Hunters Campfire, I'm sure there is something here that would satisfy even the most discerning viewer and as someone once said here, these choices are only a "click away."

Why then I ask, do people choose to open a thread, decide they are offended or disinterested in what is being discussed and instead of simply exercising their right to go elsewhere, they whine and complain about it and sometimes even demand that the discussion be immediately terminated?

Please folks, we exercise our right to pick and choose what we watch, what we read, what we listen to etc. every day, without demanding or even suggesting that the material that we consider to be offensive or uninteresting be censored.

Why then I ask can't that same standard being applied here?(end post)

Now, having expressed this please know that I am a firm believer in fair play and I have to believe much advance warning and notice was expressed privately between the players and powers that be. I have received PM's from folks who believe this has been a censorship play and I DO NOT agree with that assessment, but that reality permeates their mindsets. As mentioned before, what is offensive to some may not be offensive to others and a general rule of "no offensive conduct'is a term of art which differs in the minds of reasonable people.

The ground rules as to this mandate need to be specific and plain. Maybe even down right simple for some. I don't want to see the talent here fade away out of either ego, anger or misunderstanding. This can be fixed and worked out for the benefit of all.I am sincerely hoping this doesn't spiral into a battleground. I hope this for Mr Bin who provides a spectacular service and benefit to us all and I sincerely wish this for all of us who may be plotting and attempting to draw their lines in the sand.

Let's all rise above it!!

Here comes another 30 page thread on the Stick subject. I mostly lurk and keep my opinions to themselves but I have to chime in here because this is my biggest gripe in this country.

1. Why is it so heinous for someone to say what they believe or feel in this world today. If you don't like a person or race for their color , religion, ethnicity or whatever, why are you wrong? More so, why is it wrong for your regular white person to say it? I work amongst all types of races and ethnicities and you can bet they all have a name for caucasians and use it all the time but noone gets their panties in a wad over that do they?

2. I don't read every post here because I don't care to hear about politics or other topics. If you don't like what you are reading move on to another post or use the ignore button on the user that offends you.(it is a great feature) Why does everyone need this guy Rick or a moderator to remove material you find offensive? Moderate yourself and don't look at it. I personally find gay male sex offensive and therefore moderate myself not to visit such posts or sites. I don't need someone to remove it from the net. Banning is a form of censorship and if you think it is a good thing you might want to reconsider.

3.There were 2 people baiting each other on in that post, why was only one banned? Why is the other still trying to pick fights on other threads? To me that is irritating to see that person get one guy banned only to stick around and bait other people into another 12 page pissing contest. (Marvelous job on the other party not taking the bait and ignoring the troll.)

Undoubtedly this post will make some other person belch out their opinion on what I said to enforce their opinion upon me. I am not pro or con or part of any organization with the exception of the military. I am pro me and pro my family other than, I couldn't give a crap.

isaac types faster than me

I had little involved in the TKD thread. I made my sentiments known a couple of times and was promptly told to butt out... Which I did after making use of the 'ignore' function.

In all fairness, I believe I did play a major role in getting BS very riled up a couple of days before on the 'union' thread. I wish I had never gotten myself sullied with it. I should have done on the first day what I did on the second. But I drifted out of that one after it turned asinine. I still don't know how it ended.

The third thread, though. That one I wish I had to do over. I saw the same old argument going on and jumped Kute when I should have made my statements and then left it like I did the one earlier. Live and learn. I hate that I handled myself so poorly.

It is odd though, that I took Rick's message upon locking that thread to be aimed at me. Kind of an 'I agree with you in principle but am tired of listening to you' kind of statement. I don't blame him. Hell, I was tired of listening to myself at that point. The whole bloody mess was beyond fixing for that day.

So I butted out.

But in case there is any doubt in anyone's mind, I have never asked Rick, or anyone else, to lock a thread, delete a post, or ban a member. Ever. I've never communicated with any of the management of this sight for any reason at all.

My web time varies greatly. A few weeks a year I have a lot of time. Most times I don't. I am into preparation for the season pretty heavy now so I won't have much trouble avoiding trouble. I sincerely hope that this post sheds some light on what transpired.

Will

Bottom line is that America is fast becoming a Socialist country with a bunch of pud pulling titty babies mandating what can and cannot be spoken.......

Stick will be missed.....not by those without a sense of humor, however......and we got a bunch of Nancy's without a sense of humor and very thin skin. Liberals are quick to suggest that violence and sex on TV can be controlled by a simple click.....why do they never hear themselves?

This is a very good question and I'd like to hear the answer...
Then again....I guess I know the answer...

It is embarassing to me (when the posts are all still there for anyone wanting to waste the time to actually read them) that folks have to ask why... Or support the type of posts that Stick made.

But then I remember a little country grocery store in NE Louisiana a half-dozen years ago. It was hot, real hot, and a young black girl was coming into the store as I was leaving. I held the door open for her and she hesitated for several counts too long before entering. As she came through the door looking up at me and looking very uneasy the old man behind me cleared everything up for me about her behavior.

"Uppity [bleep]!" He said plain and loud enough for everyone to hear. I did not grow up that way and it bothers me still I said nothing to him.

There is no doubt Larry will be missed, but there will be parts of me saying I did not want Grayling seeing the hate in those posts.
art

If it eases the minds of "The Big Stick Fan Club" any,I didn't send any PM's or e-mails to Rick,about Stick.

I enjoyed butting heads with Larry,and am sorry to see him go.He should have eased back on the racial stuff,and that's what cost him.Rick didn't do anything wrong.If anyone has their panties in a wad,it's you boys that still have your nose stuck up Larry's butt.Get over it-he's gone.If you don't like it,and think "the man is holding you down",you can leave too.We don't need to hear this stuff for the next 6+ months until hunting season.

WB.

I wish you would tell me.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well, where some consider PMing Rick a petty move, I have always considered the "ignore button" much the same. There is nothing on the net that I feel I need to shield myself from.

I liked Stick, alright, didn't have problems with him, learned some along the way; I had no reason to ignore him, but then there it was.

This crowd is what's going downhill, too many Californians and/or Californian wannabes. I hope when a guy gets banned he has the option of having everything he ever typed into this site erased too...


So you want to put this on CA too?

This is not a case of PC; take it from a Californian who knows plenty regarding PC... PC has nothing to do with this.

Being called a racist because you are anti-illegal-immigration is PC.

Being called racist for being opposed to illegals getting college aid is PC.

Being called racist because you want the border controlled, is PC

Being called a racist for telling everyone "I hate spics, but everyone should own one" is not PC.

Although he was throwing some racist bombs around I'm not convinced he is really a racist, rather looking for some shock humor of the Archie Bunker type. I doubt he wouldn't hunt with somebody because they are of Asian decent...only those who know him personally know for sure.

He was wrong on this one, once Rick asked him to curb it, that should have been respected. I hope he isn't too mule headed to realize that. Someday I hope he comes back around...

Very good point. All of his Stick's posts SHOULD be deleted. His info is a reason many will still come here and search, shouldn't be able to prosper from that.

It's not nice to treat professional victoms like the rest of us...

Boy,someone is bitter.......

WB.

Roger!

I told you not to swallow if you didn't like the bitter taste.

isaac
What is so hard for DJMBOW to understand about it being the wrong time for the question? Bringing the issue up immediately after Rick shut it down was not the brightest move. Here you are asking EXACTLY the same question without the thread being locked. How can that be unless it has everything to do with timing?

Or does it? He wants to think his question was cut off. It was not. The tenor of the thread was going back into raw nerves and Rick needed to allow a cooling period.

If he really wanted an answer he should have stuck around. I think ego got in his way twice.

As far as explicit directions on how one conducts himself? Rick has stated he expects things to meet a standard a family can live with. Not all families use the same standard and Rick gives lots of leeway for those stepping over the lines... I would hate to think we had to make a list of the 8 banned words ala Carlin...
art

I would hate to think we had to make a list of the 8 banned words ala Carlin...
*********************************************************


no you just couldnt say them on TV

Sitka Deer,

That is exactly the way I took it, and I admit I was one of the ones he was telling to shut up. Nerves were frayed, blood was hot, words were flying and it was time to put it to bed. More than anyone else I think Rick was telling me to go to bed and get some sleep.

Which I promptly did.

Will

Huh?? afraid you lost me on that one.

What bothers me the most about all this is not many, if any, folks seem to remember what Rick said at the end of the TKD thread.

OK, I've let it run, you've had your fun.

I hope you all got it out of your systems.

Thread, and topic closed.

Don't push me on this one. Let it die here.

Rick

This was posted at 10:09 and if folks would have followed Rick's wishes it could have been the end of it. I can't understand how anyone could have gotten the idea that Rick was going to put up with anymore of this if they read his statement "DON'T PUSH ME ON THIS ONE. LET IT DIE HERE" Yet, a bit over an hour and someone did decide to push him by reviving it and everyone knows what happen next.

I have enjoyed what stick has had to say on this site for many years like a lot of other folks have. I too, was beginning to understand a bit of his jargon and will now miss it. But, I don't understand why he felt he had to push Rick on this, and wonder if he didn't think there would be consequences for those actions. Only he can answer that and we may never know. I don't frankly see where he left Rick any choice in the matter once the line was drawn. I can only wish stick the best in whatever he decides to do. His dedication will no doubt make it a success whatever it may be.

This isn't the first forum where something like this has happened and I can't believe it will be the last. I have to admire Rick for doing a very tough thing and it should show the rest of us he means what he says. You can't ask for more than that in any man, or woman, for my money.

How about Ihonda hijacking 2 threads that were supposed to be "thank yous" to Rick from Kutenay and VAnimrod. He didn't seem to be lettin' it go too easily, did he? And he was the very guy Rick was defendin'.....

Stick pushed the envelope, too far in this case. It's Rick's house and his word is final. That's the way it is and exactly as it should be.

On the other hand, Steelhead is exactly right - Big Stick was the reason many come to the forum. I checked in daily to read his ramblings. Some were informative, some were crude, some were designed to get a rise out of people, but they were all damn funny. This forum will be a poorer place without him.

Taken from a business angle, how many bought a McMillan or Leupold from Rick because Stick was on here daily beating the drum for them? I know I did. My first McMillan, purchased though 24Hour was 100% Stick's fault. I'm guessing I'm not alone.

Yes, Stick should have heeded Rick's warning. But the uncompromising qualities that made him who he was, probably wouldn't allow it and Rick had to make a move. Still Stick brought alot more to this site from a business, content, and entertainment perspective than the few he offended ever will.

He is the professional victom here....
He will be tolerated no matter what!!!

Say what you want about the guy, Stick was flat out the most entertainin' sumbitch to read ever, whether you agreed with him or not.........

Not to fourm savy.I like to read the campfire and learn some.Had a run in with stick as he pizzed me off on the canukial thing.Grew to respect the guy the more i read his posts. The union thread Showed me what kind of man he is.Hard work and the confidence to take it on no matter what the task.I don't think he cares all that much about been nuked.......just my guess.

I do.........

+1

WB.

Take your own advice. You seem to be the one who can't get over it and keep posting about it. One minute he sux with you and the next he is great. Which is it???

I didn't like the racial stuff.Other than that,he was fine in my book.

I can't get over it?Wow,there's some reverse psychology if I've ever seen it.....

WB.

Bart,

Correct.....

I'll just say this.

I've hung out at more than a few forums. The majority have administrators who will lock threads and ban people at the drop of a hat. (I lasted 4 posts on Democratic Underground,... those people can't handle the truth worth a chit!)

Anyway,...as far as I can see, Rick Bin exercises quite a bit of restraint here. I personally know of no one who has been banned.

I read a bit of the thread that started this discussion and it went on and on and on and on and it just kept escalating. After a while, Rick said, "OK,... that's enough."

I understand why there are some who are advocates of free speech,... I'm a freedom advocate myself.

I also recognize that some people will take advantage of others good nature about allowing free speech.

This forum is fairly administered. It has a good balance. It took 17 pages of pretty harsh bullchit for Rick to step in.

That's enough.

I wonder who would be missed more...Honda or Stick? I guess we all need to address our shooting and reloading questions to Honda from now on.

And Wheelchairbandit, why do you even post here? All you do is come here pulling your pud over Ultimate Fighting. Certainly there are some fighting forums out there.

We're all picking at an open wound.....making more out of this than it is.

To those PM'ing me, I'm deleting what I posted about Stick, and ain't gonna answer anything....sorry....

Bristoe, I'm not replying to you, I'm just too lazy to not use the Quick Reply.

There are a handful of us that have met Big Stick in person. I can't speak for everyone that has met him, but for me it was a very good experience. I don't know if we will ever cross paths again, but I wouldn't mind it if we did. That said, I highly doubt Larry lost a minutes sleep over being ban. He's been ban from other sites and he will likely be ban again someday. Hey, Stick Happens! He would be the first to tell you that. I'm not shedding a tear for him getting the boot anymore than he did. This site didn't make him who he is, nor will being banned change who he will continue to be. He will move on and so should Rick's site.

Relatively speaking, I'm still new here compared to many others and don't have the history that many do, but I'll put my 2 cents worth in anyway.

Rick does all of us a huge service by supplying this forum for us all to use and unfortunately, in this case it sounds like the line was drawn and Stick stepped over and "dared" Rick to follow up; end of Stick, he lost the game of high stakes poker because in this case Rick had all the Aces.

As for Stick himself, I loved jousting with him in a bantering manner. I do not / did not agree with all he expounded and we went round 'n round many times on issues....him baiting me and me baiting him, but I got a lot of really good info from him.

There were numerous late nights that myself, him and sometimes others would "talk" for pages on end and whenever I asked something direct and in a no BS manner, I always got a direct and useful response.

I think Stick loved the game too and played it every day.....unfortunately, some of the stuff might have been a little over the top for a few too many people.

If he starts a forum, I'll use it; if I find a forum he's using, I'll use that too.

When all is said and done, I liked they guy a lot and will certainly miss him a lot too.

Way too many whiners and crybaby wannabes on here that don't know sic'em compared to the really knowledgeable folks who post here, and there are a lot of them too.....people I have gained great respect for.

In the final analysis, none of us really know what transpired between Rick & Stick.....maybe it just went too far to be fixed, but I really wish it could have been a week or a month's timeout or suspension, instead of permanent banning.

I'm not going to get into the whole PC thing, 'cause I'd go on forever, just want to end by saying "If it's too hot in the kitchen, then get out."

MM

I got nothing against Stick. He was an entertaining kinda guy and we bantered back and forth good naturedly a few times.

*shrugg*,... but that night he made a scene and kept on making it,... put the administration in a bad position.

He should have considered that part of it,... he wouldn't.

The funny part of all this is if someone calls another white trash, ignorant, uneducated, or an alcoholic, that's apparently fine.

I've never defended Stick in any way; he didn't need it, nor did I take offense over anything he posted. I reckon I should have paid more attention in pc class when the topic of being called names was supposed to bother me. I guess having thick skin is a luxury many can't afford.

Tattle telling to Rick behind the scenes was such a puss move.


Mac

I see no funny part in any of this. You guys go on and have a conspiracy theory party and stew to your collective heart's content.

And from deep right field, here's a question posed at no one in particular: if using the ignore function was a viable option for those that took offense at BS's posts, I'm curious as to why I'm still not on your ignore. That'd work for all concerned, no? Not as much fun as rounding up the lynch mob, but better for blood pressure, one could surmise...

That's too bad, I am pretty sure I could learn a little more from Stick. Guess I will check the campfire when I need a little UFC information.....

Go blow a goat.........

LOL

I'll admit that when I finally looked at the TKD thread, I laughed so hard when I saw Jughead and Sisterman's pics....

Dave,

You headed back this way?

You didn't see the pain and confusion in those poor kids' eyes?

One more week.....

I dont realy LOL much when reading stuff on the net but I did when I seen the those pictures.

Jamie

Dang...

Once I get a few loose ends tied up I'm jumping this ship, rumor has it Paul is going also.

No.....

Yes...

You don't want to learn about sumo wrestling and UFC?

and your going to miss out on great information on rifles that sound like queer steer...

Just because you are too dense, self centered, and paranoid to "see" the humor, doesn't stop the rest of us from enjoying it, in fact it makes it even better.

beat me to it....thanks

Do you guys think it is too much to ask that if a guy walks away he be allowed to erase all posts ?

Not sure if the meek will inherit the world, but they sure are inheriting the campfire.......

I agree completely.

Do you figure a guy should go behind the scenes (P.M.)to make the request formal, or just keep bringing it up out in the open until there is a RULING ?

PM

IHonda,

I don't think you've ever made a single shooting related comment on this forum that benefited anyone that I can recall.

Do all a favor and remain forever in lurkdom; you've nothing to contribute.

Don't take this as siding with Stick, just pointing out the obvious.

MM

Um, this is neither a designated hunting nor shooting section of the forums...

Thought I'd point that out for you.

Noted; thanks for sharing!

Poor kids...

The overall purpose and thrust of the enterprise is towards shooting sports & hunting......this part is still intended for use by those with interests in those areas.

Suggest you find a more liberal forum to participate in that is more appropriate for everyone's overall and mutual benefit.

MM

Everyone? Hmm. Of 13,737 current members, how many do you speak for, exactly?

Can't say, but I would estimate a sizable majority.

Don't delude or flatter yourself that anyone here takes you seriously.

It would be a good thing if all would do as I am now as I click the "Ignore" button next to your name......you are now irrelevant.

MM

There seems to be plenty who don't get all upset over a comment about martial arts being "jip-jap" crap............................................


Reason being, martial arts is jip-jap crap, duh !

Hey 2-much-gun, what happened to your brilliant reply ?

Can't blame you for hiding (deleting) your feelings...

S'head,
Once you make a post here,it becomes Rick's property.

Now,why would ya'll be so hot to trot to delete every post you've ever made,before you leave?Do you really think folks are sitting around their PCs going,"Hmmm,I wonder what was on S'head's mind in '02?"

Now that you bring it up,folks WILL start reading all your old posts,for no other reason than you don't want them too.....

WB.

PS-oh yeah......Bye!

as did I.

Principles, look it up...

I imagine everyone would agree that the content typed into this site becomes the property of the site when it is posted, but why would it be a problem to give it back to the original poster if he requests it ?

I hope greed is not the answer...

In regards to Lhonda-I had only seen one of his posts before,which was a thread he started about a moose hunt he went on (great story).

Seemed like he'd just gone away,but then the next post I saw was on the TKD forum-about the 3rd post.He posted a very helpful,well written out response to the thread starter.

Larry responded with a racial slur.

LHonda responded with a well written out post asking Larry politely to "ease up on that stuff".Larry cranked it to the max.

LHonda was in there for the fight for certain,but all of his posts were well written,easy to read,and simply tried to explain his position to folks who didn't want to hear it.

I think the problem people have here with LHonda is that he writes extremely well,and is very well spoken.Going from butting heads with Stick,where you can hardly understand what he just wrote to you,to locking horns with a guy who writes better than many journalists can rub folks the wrong way.

He is also about as blunt as Stick,but doesn't do it in a "funny" way (I always thought Stick was overly mean,and that's why it was funny),and that bothers people.

But LHonda is no "troll".He's an asset to this forum.He has a world of hunting experience,has traveled the world,and can actually type a post that is enjoyable to read.

As always,JMHO and YMMV,but he's welcome to hunt with me anytime.

WB.

smootchie smootchie...

[
But LHonda is no "troll".He's an asset to this forum.He has a world of hunting experience,has traveled the world,and can actually type a post that is enjoyable to read.

As always,JMHO and YMMV,but he's welcome to hunt with me anytime.

WB. [/quote]

Finally a good idea. I think you guys should get on that as soon as possible. Make it a long one.

t

That would ruin so many threads,it's not even funny.

Ya'll need to get over your bad selves.If you want to leave,leave.You're not taking your "baggage" with you though.

Now if this place is so horrible,hit the road.I'm sure Larry has set up a tavern somewhere by now.Anyone can set up a small talk forum these days.

I bet he does a blog.........

WB.

I didn't realize that Rick Bin speaks to the masses through your pie hole...

Wheelchairbandit...are you implying that LHyundai is more educated than the rest of us?

I say more like swallow swallow


私は、より多くが一飲み一飲みに合うと言う

It's just common sense-why would he go to the time and the trouble to go around and delete all 2410 (and counting) of your posts,just because you're pitching a fit and leaving?

If you want to leave,just leave.The posts belong to the forum.

WB.

Many a weasely move has been followed with, "nothing personal, it's just business."............


I don't have any qualms with lhonda, but am a little chaffed over the recent banning, so what if some abrasive comments were made.

Rio Linda Boulevard is in California isn't it ?
Now I'm starting to get it, it's a California against the world thing...

LOL !

Brian is in YourReeka, go figure....

Guys
One of 'em is clueless and the other thinks it's a big joke that one of the forum's best assets is gone.
Just leave them swinging in the breeze.
t

Accraholic, I remember like a year ago we got into an arguement, at least neither of us was such a pussy that we tried to ban each other. I thought men were able to get over schit, and women were the ones that dwelled? Makes me Wonder if LHyundai isn't a chick.

Well that explains his salty demeanor...

I'm implying that LHonda is more intelligent than those who complain about him. That's why they don't like him.

I've read his posts in the TKD forum, and simply couldn't find all this �offensive� language everyone is saying he used. Plus, one of the big players in that thread popped in when he claimed LHonda brought him into it by calling him a name, when he hadn't even posted in the thread. I thought that was kind of weird at the time, as I was watching it closely. I went back today- LHonda had never mentioned that member whatsoever, nor did he say anything close to what was claimed.

The Alaska crew came after me after I ribbed them a little over the size of some of the bucks they shot, and it hasn't let up since (4-5 months now). They've flat made up things about me. I just guess LHonda is getting the same treatment.

This is the old gang mentality- find someone you don't like, and clobber them until they go away. Well, the leader of the gang just got clobbered, didn't he?

I can already see the responses coming on this post, from the Alaska crew and the Stick loyalists.....

WB.

Hmm, I don't recall the argument...so I assume I was right, as you are now !

LHyundai is a tool, and she did draw that other member into the fight. I read it, perhaps she went back and deleted it???

Can you think of anyone that would say a word if you was given the boot? I can't, and that is what I find VERY funny........

lhonda ?

Steelhead, I must say that recently I have found your posts very well written...

I read most of that stuff in a fortune cookie.......

Given the brief discussions I've had with both you and LHonda,I can come to the following conclusions.

1)He's a better writer
2)He's a nicer person (wouldn't call another man a "chick" or "woman" when they are clearly a man)
3)He proves his point much better in a debate

No wonder everyone hates him.......

WB.

Do I see a gay marriage in your future ?

Dude, you are REALLY missing Cohiba..........

Hahaha! And I would have to question "clearly a man."

Honorable fortune cookie saves day again...

Game, set and match.

Quote: But LHonda is no "troll".He's an asset to this forum.


You have at least three letters right on the forth to last word of this quote.....Fits you too....

Wow! What a long thread! I realize that this appears to be centered around Stick's racial slurs. Either you can choose to ignore, overlook, or be offended. Your call. Rick can do the same, but he can also weigh the impact that this behavior will have on the forum and act accordingly.

Racial comments aside, the one thing that really stands out in my mind was Stick's unwarranted attacks on Doug at Camera Land. Stick accused Doug of "fleecing" the Campfire members and that he knew it for a fact because he could "read sign." Several challenged him on his ability to read that sign.

He had an agenda. I'm not sure what it was because I asked him several times, but he couldn't find a way to answer. It appears that Stick really whiffed on that one due to all of the very pleased Campfire customers. Thank goodness Doug could read sign better than Stick.

Didn't read all this thread, must have happened all while I was out hunting.

I do have one thing to comment on from a few pages, seems like the offended may have had 300 or so posts. And the offendee, well can't exactly recall, but 10,000 or more.

Weird that one with so few can be so offended and that with tons more, one little more thread ends it?

Ain't my forum, but we all have faults, Stick had a few, so do I. He'll be missed for sure.

One day I'll have time to read all about it. Maybe even figure out the cameraland one etc.....

Bottom line is the owner can do what he see's fit. I was once bumped from a shooting forum, luckily many many folks went with me and it almost died, I was welcomed back. All from some comments about a gunsmith that did some of the best work in teh country on AR service rifles ,but the owner of the forum hated.. I certainly hope and don't think that this is personal.

Jeff

I made a comment about the entire Alaskan Crew being a big part of the Campfire and that I hoped the rest of 'em stuck around here...

The post entered three times for some reason, and Rick deleted all three. I'm wondering why the original post was deleted though, wouldn't have though that kind of comment was offensive.......

Also noticed on the User List that Stick is still listed as a user.......

Bet the *DELETE* thing wiped all three instead of the duplicates, the new software is still being tweaked I'll bet the farm.

Rick-

I didn't follow those threads so don't know what happened or what was said by Stick but want to comment on your comment on "free speech". I agree whole-heartedly. Free (speech) doesn't mean without responsibility in the what, how, and where contrary to what we often see in our culture.

George

Free speech still exists, it was never inferred nor implied that another would not/could not act upon what one said though........

Wildswalker:

Tried to delete the double taps only. ANd if you have the original, I can replace it where it belongs.

Rick

In other words, you are free to call someone an azzhole, and they are free to punch you in the nose. That's the way it always has been............

I remember the Camera Land comments...and they were blown way out of proportion. Stick questioned why Doug wouldn't just post prices, and also questioned how much of a "campfire deal" we were really getting. Have to admit, the campfire deals didn't seem to be any different than any internet optics site that didn't know you from Adam.

Good mornin' Rick

I'd like to remind everyone that Rick gave him a chance.



Stick's achilles heel did him in, not Rick.

Late to the dance,up to speed now.

"I may not agree with what you say,but I will defend to the death
your right to say it".

What a bunch of Nancy's.

FUBAR





Above not directed at Rick,business is business.
But,pardon my not pm'ing you,If Stick wants his posts removed
(nice even rubs and all) I think that would be the right thing to do.

Naw...

No big deal, I guess....

I was there on the thread in-question and had it out with Stick, just like Honda and WCB, though for different reasons. As far as I could tell, Stick agreed with most of what I was saying, but wanted to insult and argue with me anyway. Typical behavior of a troll. Many of his friends on here have admitted that he degenerated into a troll. Trolls are typically banned from sites.

Secondly, I'm no daisy when it comes to insulting people, and I had a couple that exceeded Stick's ready to post to him. Here's the thing...I like to spell correctly etc. rather than enter yet another problem with communication into the mix, so I typically use the "preview" capability. It is a wonderful thing because I saw that I was just being juvenile and the posts were deleted before being made. I left the thread after trading a few insults and having my words twisted around. I can twist things too, but why bother? Quite simply I made the decision that I'd rather shut off the 'puter and spend time with my family than bandy words with another internet warrior. Somebody said that Stick averaged like 26 posts per day for YEARS. Folks, there is something wrong with that.

Stick was warned by management to cease...

"Don't push me on this one. Let it die here."

...and he kept going on the race thing. This will get you banned from any site. The only free speech guaranteed here is by the leave of the owner-which is how it should be. Anybody that would use their kids the way he did, to make a racist point, has something wrong with them, in the head.

I did not PM anybody about Stick. I ain't going to judge anybody who did though. Some of the biggest backstabbing tattlers I have ever seen lost no opportunity to decry others PMing complaints. I wonder if this is how it is here.

Rick, I certainly salute you. You chose fair play and I deeply respect you for it. BS was way over the line, he was warned and he disrespected you, this site, and any decent user of this site with his behavior. If you read the thing about the typical evolution of a message board, you'll realize that a site owner can't let the gangs take over and begin to dictate how the boards are run. The owner must remain in control. I don't know how accurate the message board evolution thing is, but it mirrors an experience I've had on another site. When the gangs take over, there is no free speech because everybody who thinks differently is quashed. Thanks again Rick, for standing up for fairness in the face of some rather steep opposition. I for one, appreciate it.

WCB -

After following all of this schit for the past couple of days I can't bite my lip any longer.....

Pleeeeeease either post a pic of something you've actually shot (besides a target) or shut the [bleep] up!

It must have been terrible having all those rocks thrown at you to and from school everyday. LOSER.

Killzone, great example of how to be an [bleep] w/o being a racist. If only Big Stick could have followed your lead

Congratulations....

After 3 days of reading sticks posts here and on another site I finally figured out what happened. It is called jealousy and envy. All you stick haters can say what you want but that man is living the life!!! Jesus, what hunter/fisherman would not want to be living the life that dude has got. Anyone in AK looking for a roomate?

Some, not all by any stretch. Just an observation not a hallucination. Liberal sites seem very tolerant of such behavior.

Its not about hating Stick. Its about whats acceptable and whats not. If I came into your house and called your wife a whore what would you do? Where would you draw the line? Rick FINALLY drew the line and even let Stick cross it SEVERAL times, leaving Rick with no other option.

As Stick would say "You make your own luck". Do you honestly believe that he hasn't been pushing Rick to do this for quiet some time?

Did lhonda get canned?

just saw a post from him on moose hunting. didn't check the time/date ...

And if not, why not?

I am not referring to him being banned. I am taliking about all the chitheads that can't contain their glee he's gone. Not one them has a post that legitimately contributes to this site. Now if this were a UFC site...

Not...

He posted in the Alaska forum today, go figure...

you're calling out a ton of folks who have made contributions there, ksmith. of course, they're probably too polite to call you on your challenge ...
i have stated emphatically i am not gleeful over this situation. i have stated it is, instead, a sad situation.
nevertheless, i must ask: care to list any of your own contributions among your 60 posts?
and what's a "chithead" anyway? somebody with a post-it note for a noggin?
all meant in good fun, of course ...

Dude, you know Rick's not the type to throw "Cans" around.........

The end of the road, for me, at least, occurred several weeks ago. It was an exchange between BS and jorge1. BS saw fit to respond to jorge by denegrating the pronunciation of his name. In my view, that was totally beyond the pale.
On the bright side- the sun will come up tomorrow morning, and those who choose to wear boots other than Meindls, to shoot rifles other than Remington 700's, who choose to use scopes other than Leupold, without the crab eyeball-like turret appendages atop, to own and shoot all manner of firearms besides bolt actions, to utilize synthetic stocks not made by M- to hunt in areas and countries outside of Alaska-
it's a good day....

I had no idea you were so sensitive about UFC. Wasn't calling alot of folks out here bud, just 3.

Now this really sucks!!! I have a question for Stick about a Mickey stock and he went and got himself banned from the site�.

Ask honda....

Besides, I don't come here to contribute, I come here to learn.
Of course i could post of my crappy deer season and show you a pic of the smallest doe ever shot in the state of VA.

KSMITH;

I think, that doe would have competition...

What'd she weigh, dressed?

AHHH No dude Seriously I have a real question about a Mickey stock and I don�t believe he can help. But I know for a fact Stick can answer my?

joecool;

Do a little search here, in the archives. Or, see what the other 13000 or so members know....

Just a thought....

Yep I think so too. Check Blammer's post re his "11 point NC buck" I do hear that it tasted good though

Smallest this year, weighed 42#, dressed.

Know, that there have been smaller taken.... one in particular, who fit in a cooler... intact....

I am gonna regret this but...30lbs. It looked big..

har! good one k, about the doe.
i've killed a cooler-creeper or two myself ...
but man, they taste good.

You guys should be banned.........

for admitting that!!

probably right...

they just look so BIG in the FOV of a 6x42 ...

I actually ran this one off from under my stand and saw it 10 minutes lster eating acorns at about 50yds. After the 7mm went off and seen it roll twice, I knew it was going to be a long night at the camp.

I can't believe I read this whole thing!

hey, it took a turn for the better in the past few posts.

Post deleted by 375matt

I'm betting there are a lot more stories like that if the truth be known. In over 50 years of hunting I have to confess to boning out some pretty small critters. Some weren't much bigger than my dog.

I fall into the "overall" catagory...

I for one am way friggin tired of the pissin' & moanin that is a goin' on here.

There is what, three threads for the same topic?

I will miss the input of all lost here, as I am sure there will be more to come, unfourtunatly...

Deal with it!

Nobody died in a flaming helo accident, car crash, house fire, whatever!
Some may feel like they were raped or some other bullsh!!t, once again, deal with it!

Look around the net, I am sure you can find The Stick, living & breathing elsewhere, he may be back here, ONE DAY.

"The overall purpose and thrust of the enterprise is towards shooting sports & hunting......"

So let it be written, So let it be done...

Pat

Simply put BS had a lot of good knowledge and I'll miss it. I've been reading this forum for a little over 5 years, and I will note that his posts used to be more tame and helpful. In recent year(s) I've noticed a decline in quality of some posts and more bullying; and I'll admit some of it was in good humor, but some of it was simply arrogant. We all are guilty at times.

With that said I think it is advisable to realize that there are a lot of other members on this forum with a wealth of knowledge. While they may not broadcast themselves like Stick did, they can help you on anything you might need. Let's face it, truing a 700 and matching it with a decent stock, barrel and glass is not rocket science, and any technical specs that might be needed are most easily attained by going directly to the manufacturer...didn't BS always dote on getting it straight from the horse's mouth? Members here are good for relating fit and form and function through experience. There are enough competitive shooters and excellent reloaders to help with all of the techy details that can get confusing at times.

What's done is done, and the man's transition and ultimate fate was in his own hands. We can complain about it (and accomplish nothing) or we can tap into the vast amount of knowledge that is still available here and keep the fire burning. Good things (expected and unexpected) will come about when good things are pursued...so let's get back to it.

Ya got the "unfortunately" part right. Damn, I hate to see anyone leave/get tossed out whatever.

So long whosever pulling up stakes, there's been some good times had around here.

Birdwatcher