Sonic asks customers not to bring guns to its dining areas
By Brianna Bailey PUBLISHED: MAY 31, 2014
Sonic Corp. is asking customers to refrain from bringing guns to its indoor restaurants and patio dining areas at Sonic Drive-Ins. The company had been under pressure to revise its firearms policies from the gun control group Moms Demand Action for Gun Sense in America.
Patrick Lennow, a spokesman for Oklahoma City-based Sonic, said the company has not changed its gun policy because it previously had no policy, instead relying on local laws.
�Sonic and our franchise owners work hard to provide an inviting environment for customers and employees alike. While we historically have relied upon local laws to guide how we address the display of guns at drive-ins, recent actions required we carefully reconsider this approach,� the company said in a statement. �We've considered the views and desires of our customers and employees that staff the drive-ins across the country.�
Most Sonic locations are drive-ins, where customers order in their cars, further complicating the gun issue. There are about 3,500 Sonic Drive-In franchise and corporate locations throughout 44 states. Sonic has about 270 locations in Oklahoma, which legalized the open carry of firearms in 2012.
�With respect to the storage of guns in vehicles, we ask that our customers continue to honor local laws,� Sonic said in its statement.
The group Moms Demand Action has asked several restaurant chains to ban guns in their dining areas after members of the Texas gun rights group Open Carry Texas began posting videos on YouTube of members carrying rifles and other firearms into restaurants in San Antonio. One video, which since has been deleted, showed a group of men carrying rifles to a Sonic patio dining area in Texas. A Sonic employee asked the men to leave the restaurant.
�We are heartened that we can take our children to these family-oriented restaurants and not worry about being confronted by customers with semiautomatic rifles,� Shannon Watts, founder of Moms Demand Action for Gun Sense in America, said in a statement Friday in response to the new Sonic policy on guns.
The restaurant chain Chili's also moved to revise its gun policy on Friday in response to a petition from the group Moms Demand Action. The restaurant chain Chipotle banned guns at its restaurants last week after pressure from the group.
When I "bring a gun" to a public place, I am packing discreetly. Open carry, when abused in such a really stupid way turns the tide of public appearance against us. CAN do and SHOULD do are, in many cases, very different things.
I do not understand this open carry nonsense. I have a concealed carry permit and I do not want anyone to know that I am carrying. I feel that open carry does nothing to help our cause with the non-gun owning public.
Ok, now is Sonic going to go all out, explain its position, and ask all criminals to not bring their weapons into the dining areas - in a nice tone, of course? That policy should work, eh?
I personally don't think open carry in public businesses help the Gun Owners in the long run. If i was going to rob a place the first person i would take out would be the ones who were carrying in the open . Why set yourself up as a target . If you are going to carry then conceal the weapon . Open carry in the woods and fields is a whole different ball game .
I personally don't think open carry in public businesses help the Gun Owners in the long run. If i was going to rob a place the first person i would take out would be the ones who were carrying in the open . Why set yourself up as a target . If you are going to carry then conceal the weapon . Open carry in the woods and fields is a whole different ball game .
These old boys are just trying to get open carry passed as law in Texas. Currently it's legal to carry rifles and BP pistols. That's what they are doing. Of course it scares people in dallas/Fort Worth area. The state office of this group has asked them to stop from the damage they are doing in this area with all the new city laws. I don't think the Legislature will bring it up, but no telling. I'll ask a question--what's the fastest way to get into the State Capitol building of Tex. Answer- A CHL lic. with the pistol.
By passes the crowd in line/ get to go to the special line.
Sonic is trying to rid their courtyard of the guys with the rifles slung over their back.
Ultimately, those that carry closed will continue to carry closed on Sonic property, whether Sonic likes it or not. Same goes for weapons in a vehicle.
Bunch of dumbazzes carrying guns around like that --low IQ bunch for sure.
I am not entirely in agreement with you, but I have to admit that seeing a bunch of guys carrying long arms in a restaurant makes me doubt their motives/sanity/prudence.
I simply don't want to eat a cheeseburger in close proximity to some dumbschit with an AR strapped to his back.
Go eat at Burger King then. Problem solved. Open carry is already the law of the land, it's just that the law is being infringed upon. You anti's will just have to get used to seeing guns and maybe see a Therapist for your issues. Freud said that a fear of guns was a sign of sexual immaturity.
Sonic is trying to rid their courtyard of the guys with the rifles slung over their back.
Ultimately, those that carry closed will continue to carry closed on Sonic property, whether Sonic likes it or not. Same goes for weapons in a vehicle.
I don't know why anybody would eat at Sonic unless there was no other choice. Mickey D's and Booger King suck worse though. Sonic food is about like Alpo.
Whataburger and Jack in the Box are so much better than any of those places it's unreal. Wendy's even sucks less and they're pretty worthless anymore. I ate at Cheeseburger in Paradise one time and the food wasn't great and it was high dollar. The service sucked. Five Guys just sounds too gay.
I don't know why anybody would eat at Sonic unless there was no other choice.
I agree, JITB is better than Sonic, but Sonic is one of the few chain restaurants that will take a chance on a small town America.
There's a small town 12 miles to the East of me, just a few thousand residents. Sonic is pretty much the only game in town and they get all the business...
Whataburger and Jack in the Box are so much better than any of those places it's unreal. Wendy's even sucks less and they're pretty worthless anymore. I ate at Cheeseburger in Paradise one time and the food wasn't great and it was high dollar. The service sucked. Five Guys just sounds too gay.
We had a Whataburger in this area for years when I first moved here. I just assumed it was a Burger King wannabe (never heard of it before then), so never tried it. They closed their doors a few years ago. Now I'm sorry I never tried it. Link
It's a shame these over zealous clowns have further tarnished the image of law abiding gun owners. If they'd behaved themselves like most of us do, then Sonic and Chili's wouldn't have been forced into a decision. Starbucks was forced down the same road at gunpoint, so it was no surprise that Sonic/Chili's responded the same.
It's their establishments and my money. We're BOTH free to do as we please. I don't personally hold a grudge against Starbucks or Sonic, although I DO boycott those business that have proactively posted their "zone" signs without having been forced into.
The homosexual movement has gotten away with their desensitization tactics and can cry "foul" anytime they feel their mission has been compromised or threatened. Gun owners CANNOT use the same playbook or they'll have their azzes handed to them before they realize the game is over. Period.
Public relations effects public opinion which in turn drives legislation, good or bad. If these gun toting clowns don't get themselves under control we will ALL pay the price, and in fairly short order. We need to be "policing our own" while at the same time introducing firearms in a positive way to the ignorant masses who haven't yet formed an opinion.
I never realized there were so many anti-gun people on the Fire. Who would have thought it.
Tell me about it. What would Lucas McCain think of it? He rarely left his Model 92 in the wagon when he went into the Madera House Hotel for a steak with his son, Mark, or Marshall Torrance.
It's a shame these over zealous clowns have further tarnished the image of law abiding gun owners. If they'd behaved themselves like most of us do, then Sonic and Chili's wouldn't have been forced into a decision. Starbucks was forced down the same road at gunpoint, so it was no surprise that Sonic/Chili's responded the same.
It's their establishments and my money. We're BOTH free to do as we please. I don't personally hold a grudge against Starbucks or Sonic, although I DO boycott those business that have proactively posted their "zone" signs without having been forced into.
The homosexual movement has gotten away with their desensitization tactics and can cry "foul" anytime they feel their mission has been compromised or threatened. Gun owners CANNOT use the same playbook or they'll have their azzes handed to them before they realize the game is over. Period.
Public relations effects public opinion which in turn drives legislation, good or bad. If these gun toting clowns don't get themselves under control we will ALL pay the price, and in fairly short order. We need to be "policing our own" while at the same time introducing firearms in a positive way to the ignorant masses who haven't yet formed an opinion.
Very good post , common modern sense, which is lacking at times around here.
I never realized there were so many anti-gun people on the Fire. Who would have thought it.
Tell me about it. What would Lucas McCain think of it? He rarely left his Model 92 in the wagon when he went into the Madera House Hotel for a steak with his son, Mark, or Marshall Torrance.
True. I guess under those rules all the cops that open carry need to leave their weapons in the car also.
Mouth breathers have 2nd amendment rights too. If the bozo wants to go the local Stop & Rob for a Big Gulp with an M-1 Garand slung over his shoulder, so be it. It will either deter the bad guys or offer them their first target. Meanwhile, us CPL guys will either scram or put two behind the bad guys ear. Win/win.
I never realized there were so many anti-gun people on the Fire. Who would have thought it.
I'm not anti- gun, I'm anti-dumbschit toting around an AR at food places for no fuggin reason.
How's that for the King's English?
The more people toting guns the less crime. Nobody is going to rob a place with everybody packing both open and CCW.
Maybe, I just don't want to try and eat my cheeseburger next to a guy with an AR that may or may not be an unhinged psycho.
If he/she is toting an AR or anything else for that matter out in the open and eating a hamburger the odds of being an unhinged psycho is slim to none at all and slim left Dodge. Yours odds of winning the big lotto jackpot are better than being shot by open carry eating a hamburger.
Again I can't believe all the hoplophobia on the Fire. Who would have thought it!!!!!!!!!
The gays sue when private businesses "discriminate" against them and it works. Maybe a lawsuit against these private businesses that are discriminating against lawabiding gun owners would change things.
There are some interesting questions that could bring about a change of view though. How many robberies have happend at places where people were openly carrying? How man accidental discharges have happend? Injuries from the accidental discharge?
Scarring people rarely helps win them over. Bringing a carbine into a eatery is questionable in it's effectiveness at influencing people in a good way. Far less offensive seems to be a holstered handgun.
Where I live I don't think either would cause much of a problem, but I've never brought my AR into a store. No one has said anything about my handgun.
If he/she is toting an AR or anything else for that matter out in the open and eating a hamburger the odds of being an unhinged psycho is slim to none at all and slim left Dodge.
Possibly, but after visiting public gun ranges and watching how some of these gun-owners violate every safe gun handling procedure ever recorded, I'd say your chances of getting accidentally shot by an "unloaded" firearm increase significantly. And I'd prefer not to get "accidentally shot" while I'm eating...
Ever go to a range and notice all the bullet marks that are 8ft up in the air by the light fixtures,....somebody put those there...
When I "bring a gun" to a public place, I am packing discreetly. Open carry, when abused in such a really stupid way turns the tide of public appearance against us. CAN do and SHOULD do are, in many cases, very different things.
Exactly! I don't agree with their lifestyle, but look at all of the strides the gay community has made by being low key. Never see much out of them and they are getting rewarded for it nationwide.
Maybe, I just don't want to try and eat my cheeseburger next to a guy with an AR that may or may not be an unhinged psycho.
Think about that for a minute, Ghost. Isn't it just as likely that other folks in there are carrying that you don't know about? Bad guys don't usually, in fact, telegraph their intentions by openly carrying. That's the reason concealed carry was outlawed, except with special permission, to start with, i.e., under the assumption that honest folks go about with their weapons openly carried, while bad guys have reason to hide that they're armed.
I simply don't want to eat a cheeseburger in close proximity to some dumbschit with an AR strapped to his back.
Good thing you were never in the military. You would have been scared to death Do all guns frighten you, or just Ar's?
It doesn't make the least difference if it makes you, me, Ghostinthemachine, or Safariman nervous or not. The reason it's a stupid thing to do is that it "DOES" make a lot of other people nervous that might otherwise be on our side. They see this stupid stuff and wonder if we have sense enough to be trusted, and I can't blame them.
Maybe, I just don't want to try and eat my cheeseburger next to a guy with an AR that may or may not be an unhinged psycho.
Think about that for a minute, Ghost. Isn't it just as likely that other folks in there are carrying that you don't know about? Bad guys don't usually, in fact, telegraph their intentions by openly carrying. That's the reason concealed carry was outlawed, except with special permission, to start with, i.e., under the assumption that honest folks go about with their weapons openly carried, while bad guys have reason to hide that they're armed.
I know exactly what you're saying. I'm just being honest about how myself and many others would respond to seeing it.
It doesn't make the least difference if it makes you, me, Ghostinthemachine, or Safariman nervous or not. The reason it's a stupid thing to do is that it "DOES" make a lot of other people nervous that might otherwise be on our side. They see this stupid stuff and wonder if we have sense enough to be trusted, and I can't blame them.
I am with those who, aside from suporting the freedom to do so, would prefer that others not openly display firearms just for show in most public settings. But, I do not agree with your above reasoning that it is "stupid" to do so.
Lots of things make people nervous, but the absence of nervous instances does not enable or cause them to "change sides" about such stimuli - their ignorance of lack of familiarity simply persists and the bias continues. If a person is so small-minded and emotion driven that he/she cannot think about the logical aspects of firearm possession in a rational manner, there seems no reason whatsoever to pander to their frailty - because pandering there will do no good. And, there is the possibility that ongoing exposure to stimuli which now make them nervous - absent negative results - might actually help them "get over it".
In addition, I think the matter of firearms familiarity and acceptance is much more complex than "our side and their side" - it might be nice if it were that simple. If there is a contest involved, I think it has to do with rationality, facts and experience being the winner over emotion and rather blind ideology.
Again, in most cases I would prefer that folks not draw undue attention to carried firearms just for the sake of display - but I do not agree that such is blanket stupidity.
I believe religion should be the same way. Keep it and shut the [bleep] up.
No, Christians shouldn't preach to those who have made it clear they don't want to hear it. We are however mandated by Christ himself to spread the Good news. Please forgive those of us who don't understand that, and instead preach condemnation. They are wrong but they mean well.
It doesn't make the least difference if it makes you, me, Ghostinthemachine, or Safariman nervous or not. The reason it's a stupid thing to do is that it "DOES" make a lot of other people nervous that might otherwise be on our side. They see this stupid stuff and wonder if we have sense enough to be trusted, and I can't blame them.
I am with those who, aside from suporting the freedom to do so, would prefer that others not openly display firearms just for show in most public settings. But, I do not agree with your above reasoning that it is "stupid" to do so.
Lots of things make people nervous, but the absence of nervous instances does not enable or cause them to "change sides" about such stimuli - their ignorance of lack of familiarity simply persists and the bias continues. If a person is so small-minded and emotion driven that he/she cannot think about the logical aspects of firearm possession in a rational manner, there seems no reason whatsoever to pander to their frailty - because pandering there will do no good. And, there is the possibility that ongoing exposure to stimuli which now make them nervous - absent negative results - might actually help them "get over it".
In addition, I think the matter of firearms familiarity and acceptance is much more complex than "our side and their side" - it might be nice if it were that simple. If there is a contest involved, I think it has to do with rationality, facts and experience being the winner over emotion and rather blind ideology.
Again, in most cases I would prefer that folks not draw undue attention to carried firearms just for the sake of display - but I do not agree that such is blanket stupidity.
I understand what you are saying and agree with the spirit of it. I just think we should be as smart as the liberals and start out with "Three's Company" rather than " Brokeback Mountain".
Maybe, I just don't want to try and eat my cheeseburger next to a guy with an AR that may or may not be an unhinged psycho.
Think about that for a minute, Ghost. Isn't it just as likely that other folks in there are carrying that you don't know about? Bad guys don't usually, in fact, telegraph their intentions by openly carrying. That's the reason concealed carry was outlawed, except with special permission, to start with, i.e., under the assumption that honest folks go about with their weapons openly carried, while bad guys have reason to hide that they're armed.
I know exactly what you're saying. I'm just being honest about how myself and many others would respond to seeing it.
I think I know what you're saying. Same reason I try to avoid the popular hours and days at the outdoor range, especially leading up to deer season.
If he/she is toting an AR or anything else for that matter out in the open and eating a hamburger the odds of being an unhinged psycho is slim to none at all and slim left Dodge.
Possibly, but after visiting public gun ranges and watching how some of these gun-owners violate every safe gun handling procedure ever recorded, I'd say your chances of getting accidentally shot by an "unloaded" firearm increase significantly. And I'd prefer not to get "accidentally shot" while I'm eating...
Ever go to a range and notice all the bullet marks that are 8ft up in the air by the light fixtures,....somebody put those there...
My shooting range is out doors so I haven't noticed any holes in the sky.
However, the roof over the shooting bench appears to be safe no holes yet.
Maybe, I just don't want to try and eat my cheeseburger next to a guy with an AR that may or may not be an unhinged psycho.
Think about that for a minute, Ghost. Isn't it just as likely that other folks in there are carrying that you don't know about? Bad guys don't usually, in fact, telegraph their intentions by openly carrying. That's the reason concealed carry was outlawed, except with special permission, to start with, i.e., under the assumption that honest folks go about with their weapons openly carried, while bad guys have reason to hide that they're armed.
If he/she is toting an AR or anything else for that matter out in the open and eating a hamburger the odds of being an unhinged psycho is slim to none at all and slim left Dodge.
Possibly, but after visiting public gun ranges and watching how some of these gun-owners violate every safe gun handling procedure ever recorded, I'd say your chances of getting accidentally shot by an "unloaded" firearm increase significantly. And I'd prefer not to get "accidentally shot" while I'm eating...
Ever go to a range and notice all the bullet marks that are 8ft up in the air by the light fixtures,....somebody put those there...
I'm in this camp, our range in Yuma is so scary I wont even go out there unless our club has control of it for an organized event. I am not afraid of the EBR's, I am VERY LEERY of some of the nutcases I see out there with them. If I was in an eatery and a bunch of these guys walked in with their guns I would depart toot sweet.
Yep, only police/retired police should be allowed to carry openly(or at all) since they do not have accidental discharges.
And that makes you smile because you just don't have to worry about police/retred police not hitting what they aim at. There is a whole Florida movie theatre full of folks who are lucky to be alive because a retired police officer(armed due to the Federal LE carry privelege) was on the spot and able to stop a madman before he wiped out the whole place back in the winter as an example.
As a private business, Sonic has the right to ask customers to do whatever it wants. The customers have the right to spend their hard earned money where they want as well. We owned restaurants in Memphis until we retired two years ago and had a firm policy about gun carry in them. We put up a sign that said the public was welcome to bring concealed handguns into our restaurants at any time, but since some of our customers were concerned about open carry, we asked everyone to please respect others rights and not carry an open weapon in the restaurant or patio area. We never had a problem of any kind. We also never had a robbery since the bad guys knew many people, including me, had a handgun on them. Nice perk.
If open carry in your restaurant was legal, then no customer had a "right" (that needed to be respected) to prevent another customer from open carrying. I agree with the owner's right to refuse service to anyone for any reason.
I was in Golden Corral eating the other day and the guy next to me and my wife was carrying open . My wife said why is he carrying a pistol , and i said because in TN open carry is legal . I told him i like his choice of the Glock 30 and he looked surprised that i knew what he was carrying. I reminded my wife , i'm carrying to , but the difference was, she looked at it different just because his pistol was in the open where she could see it. I also noticed other people staring at him to and it was because they could actually see the weapon. We sit and talked about guns while eating and i told him I was also carrying a 45 acp but mine was the 1911. He said he needed to get a conceal carry permit and i told him it wouldn't be a bad idea.
If open carry in your restaurant was legal, then no customer had a "right" (that needed to be respected) to prevent another customer from open carrying. I agree with the owner's right to refuse service to anyone for any reason.
Yep, I am like you and think we need to get back to having coloreds pick their meals up at the back door instead of sitting and eating where ever they please.
I've had a concealed carry permit in 3 states over the last 40 years and almost always go armed. However I have never had a need or even a reason to carry a long gun into a business establishment other than to a gun shop for either trade or repair. While it may be a right who said you had to exercise all your rights. I have never seen anything wrong with someone wearing a discreet handgun and have heard very few complaints about it,but long guns are more than dumb. I cannot think of a more inappropriate way of exercising my gun rights than this. It actually offends me there are so many dumb gun owners.
I've had a concealed carry permit in 3 states over the last 40 years and almost always go armed. However I have never had a need or even a reason to carry a long gun into a business establishment other than to a gun shop for either trade or repair. While it may be a right who said you had to exercise all your rights. I have never seen anything wrong with someone wearing a discreet handgun and have heard very few complaints about it,but long guns are more than dumb. I cannot think of a more inappropriate way of exercising my gun rights than this. It actually offends me there are so many dumb gun owners.
Right on! Like I mentioned earlier, we don't see any public antics out of the gay community and the governments have decided to ease up on them while the looney gun owners have been out marching and firing off guns in public for decades and look where it has gotten their extremists.
I've had a concealed carry permit in 3 states over the last 40 years and almost always go armed. However I have never had a need or even a reason to carry a long gun into a business establishment other than to a gun shop for either trade or repair. While it may be a right who said you had to exercise all your rights. I have never seen anything wrong with someone wearing a discreet handgun and have heard very few complaints about it,but long guns are more than dumb. I cannot think of a more inappropriate way of exercising my gun rights than this. It actually offends me there are so many dumb gun owners.
Lucas McCain rarely left his rifle in the wagon when he went into a local eatery for a meal.
It appears that OCT maybe changing their strategy.
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE � Come and Take It Texas, Texas Carry, Gun Rights Across America and Open Carry Texas Joint Statement on OC of Long Arms
Over the past year, our members have done what no other organization has been able to do � put open carry at the forefront of the fight to restore gun rights for all Texans. As we have grown, we have had to adjust our efforts based on lessons learned through hundreds of open carry events, big and small.
Looking back, it has become clear that there is one area in which we have gotten the most resistance and suffered the largest setbacks: open carry of long arms into private businesses. This is not a new phenomenon. Early on, because of our efforts, the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission (TABC) sent a message to all TABC licensees warning them about allowing our members to open carry into their businesses. This resulted in places like Smashburger asking us to leave our guns at home. Since then, Starbucks, Wendy�s, Jack In The Box, Applebees and most recently, Chipotle have come out asking we not carry our firearms into their establishments.
Whereas, our mission is to get open carry of handguns passed in Texas, we must once again adjust in a way that shines a positive light on our efforts, our members, and our respective organizations. We have decided the prudent path, to further our goals, is to immediately cease taking long guns into corporate businesses unless invited. Black Powder revolvers have proven to be very effective and align with our goal of legalizing open carry with a handgun. We do understand that not everyone will be able to afford one, but if you can, we are requesting you do so. Almost every leader has gone to Black powder for a reason. It works.
For all further open carry walks with long guns, we are adopting the following unified protocol and general policy to best ensure meeting our respective legislative mission to legalize open carry:
1) Always notify local law enforcement prior to the walk, especially the day of 2) Carry Flags and signs during your walk to increase awareness 3) Carry the long gun on a sling, not held 4) Do not go into corporate businesses without prior permission, preferably not at all 5) If asked to leave, do so quietly and do not make it a problem 6) Do not post pics publicly if you do get permission and are able to OC in a cooperate business 7) Do not go into businesses with TABC signs posted with a long gun (Ever) 8) If at all possible, keep to local small businesses that are 2A friendly
We ask that members take a step back and make an objective assessment of what we are trying to accomplish and help us to get open carry passed for everyone. We must be willing and able to recognize what works and what doesn�t, but we need your help to make these efforts a success. It will be very difficult to spin holstered, black powder revolvers into a negative story. This is the goal we are currently striving for, open carry of handguns. We know everyone is working hard for this cause. It is simply time to focus on what has been proven to work. The conversation has shifted from open carry of handguns to rifles in businesses, negating our efforts and distracting us from our mission.
We are winning. Because we are winning, we have come under increased scrutiny by media and politicians. Let�s use that spotlight and make the most positive impact we can!
Sonic is trying to rid their courtyard of the guys with the rifles slung over their back.
Ultimately, those that carry closed will continue to carry closed on Sonic property, whether Sonic likes it or not. Same goes for weapons in a vehicle.
I don't know why anybody would eat at Sonic unless there was no other choice. Mickey D's and Booger King suck worse though. Sonic food is about like Alpo.
that just is not true, here you can get a sonic burger with chilles on it, which is the way it should be.
I've had a concealed carry permit in 3 states over the last 40 years and almost always go armed. However I have never had a need or even a reason to carry a long gun into a business establishment other than to a gun shop for either trade or repair. While it may be a right who said you had to exercise all your rights. I have never seen anything wrong with someone wearing a discreet handgun and have heard very few complaints about it,but long guns are more than dumb. I cannot think of a more inappropriate way of exercising my gun rights than this. It actually offends me there are so many dumb gun owners.
Lucas McCain rarely left his rifle in the wagon when he went into a local eatery for a meal.
I sort of wonder why these OC guys don't have a CPL. Too lazy? Too cheap? Can't get one because of prior criminal convictions? Inquiring minds want to know.
If I owned a business I wouldn't want people coming in slinging ARs, shotguns, or anything else either. Would have no issue with legal concealed carry, but that open carry because I can is just dumb.
I sort of wonder why these OC guys don't have a CPL. Too lazy? Too cheap? Can't get one because of prior criminal convictions? Inquiring minds want to know.
I think they're doing a good service in what they do. If the right exists, it should be exercised by someone. The more someone is out there exercising the very outer limits of our rights, the less likely the less extreme limits of our rights (those we exercise frequently, and regularly depend on) will be threatened with infringement.
If I owned a business I wouldn't want people coming in slinging ARs, shotguns, or anything else either. Would have no issue with legal concealed carry, but that open carry because I can is just dumb.
I agree with the right of property owners to set the terms of entry. I don't care if they post signs prohibiting Irish, even. Such signs and policies should be allowed to be enforced or property ownership is a sham.
Of all of our "there is a guy with a gun downtown" calls, they seem to always be these open carry guys carrying long guns around, dressed up like "operators" with shemaghs, "tactical" shirts and kaki pants. Yet there has been numerous times where i have seen people dressed normally and openly carrying handguns go comletely unnoticed.
I'm all for open carry, but using some logic has to come into play at somepoint. Just because you CAN do something, doesn't always mean you SHOULD do something. These people know they are going to create a panic yet they gobahead and do it and then bitchhh and moan when cops get called.
Just because you CAN do something, doesn't always mean you SHOULD do something.
I am sure you don't mean for that statement to apply to police and their priveleges. For them the sky should be the limit, for civilians the limit should be the sky.
I carry concealed ALL the time by choice, even in IL where it is "illegal". If nobody knows, nobody has their feathers ruffled.
Been CCW since I got out of the Army and will continue to do so for as long as I am competent.
AND I will NOT let the .gov be the one to determine whether I am or not either!
Excellent post TLee. I was talking with my nephew, who is a Federal LEO, he said his dad said to him he didn't realize that he was packing to which he replied that's the point he didn't want people to know he was packing, at which point he showed me the little Keltec 380 ACP in a pocket holster that I had given him last year when he was out here on vacation. He is a Federal Firearms range officer. He sets up firearms safety and range programs for all the Homeland Security forces.
I carry concealed ALL the time by choice, even in IL where it is "illegal". If nobody knows, nobody has their feathers ruffled.
Been CCW since I got out of the Army and will continue to do so for as long as I am competent.
AND I will NOT let the .gov be the one to determine whether I am or not either!
Excellent post TLee. I was talking with my nephew, who is a Federal LEO, he said his dad said to him he didn't realize that he was packing to which he replied that's the point he didn't want people to know he was packing, at which point he showed me the little Keltec 380 ACP in a pocket holster that I had given him last year when he was out here on vacation. He is a Federal Firearms range officer. He sets up firearms safety and range programs for all the Homeland Security forces.
Ha! Another police exemption privelege! Doing that with anyone else would have been a federal felony!
I sort of wonder why these OC guys don't have a CPL. Too lazy? Too cheap? Can't get one because of prior criminal convictions? Inquiring minds want to know.
I think they're doing a good service in what they do. If the right exists, it should be exercised by someone. The more someone is out there exercising the very outer limits of our rights, the less likely the less extreme limits of our rights (those we exercise frequently, and regularly depend on) will be threatened with infringement.
If I owned a business I wouldn't want people coming in slinging ARs, shotguns, or anything else either. Would have no issue with legal concealed carry, but that open carry because I can is just dumb.
I agree with the right of property owners to set the terms of entry. I don't care if they post signs prohibiting Irish, even. Such signs and policies should be allowed to be enforced or property ownership is a sham.
Joe The Plumber makes an ill-timed 'comment' about his gun rights, and the majority who've responded to that thread are supportive of him.
These guys carrying their guns are actually exercising those same rights that Joe The Plumber was just giving lip service to, and the majority who've responded to this thread are castigating them for it.
Yep, only police/retired police should be allowed to carry openly(or at all) since they do not have accidental discharges.
And that makes you smile because you just don't have to worry about police/retred police not hitting what they aim at. There is a whole Florida movie theatre full of folks who are lucky to be alive because a retired police officer(armed due to the Federal LE carry privelege) was on the spot and able to stop a madman before he wiped out the whole place back in the winter as an example.
What makes me laugh is how funny you are and how many chains you are jerking.
Seems to me that the guys carrying a rifle in a restaurant like that are inmature. Probably the same group of guys that are militia members because they think its cool and would run like hell at the first little clue that the $hit was about to hit the fan. Attention queens.
Seems to me that the guys carrying a rifle in a restaurant like that are inmature. Probably the same group of guys that are militia members because they think its cool and would run like hell at the first little clue that the $hit was about to hit the fan. Attention queens.
Maybe; but they'd be armed. You on the other hand, would have a chili dog to fend off your attacker
Seems to me that the guys carrying a rifle in a restaurant like that are inmature. Probably the same group of guys that are militia members because they think its cool and would run like hell at the first little clue that the $hit was about to hit the fan. Attention queens.
Yep, but if they ever showed up someplace with overwhelming numbers and/or technology(like the US military does it) they might feel emboldened to stand their ground and fight and that could be a real danger to public safety.
Joe The Plumber makes an ill-timed 'comment' about his gun rights, and the majority who've responded to that thread are supportive of him.
These guys carrying their guns are actually exercising those same rights that Joe The Plumber was just giving lip service to, and the majority who've responded to this thread are castigating them for it.
laffin' some more
Not true, these open carry demonstrators do NOT have a Legal or Constitution Right to carry on Private Property if the owned says "No Guns Allowed". It's not that hard to understand if you take your head out of your a$$.
Seems to me that the guys carrying a rifle in a restaurant like that are inmature. Probably the same group of guys that are militia members because they think its cool and would run like hell at the first little clue that the $hit was about to hit the fan. Attention queens.
Maybe; but they'd be armed. You on the other hand, would have a chili dog to fend off your attacker
He's a SEAL, says so in his user name. Be he keeps some sort of super freeze pack with his blowout kit so he could freeze the footlong and use it as a truncheon.
Joe The Plumber makes an ill-timed 'comment' about his gun rights, and the majority who've responded to that thread are supportive of him.
These guys carrying their guns are actually exercising those same rights that Joe The Plumber was just giving lip service to, and the majority who've responded to this thread are castigating them for it.
laffin' some more
Not true, these open carry demonstrators do NOT have a Legal or Constitution Right to carry on Private Property if the owned says "No Guns Allowed". It's not that hard to understand if you take your head out of your a$$.
Yep, businesses get public subsidies which they have a right to that unfortunately prevents them from keeping blacks and similar off their property, but they are allowed to discriminate against firearms owners.
I wondered when that video was going to show up. He's an ATF officer, and yes he is a dumb a$$.
That video is always labeled as him being a DEA agent. My guess is it was totally faked by some of these open carry loons to make real police who don't screw up look bad.
Joe The Plumber makes an ill-timed 'comment' about his gun rights, and the majority who've responded to that thread are supportive of him.
These guys carrying their guns are actually exercising those same rights that Joe The Plumber was just giving lip service to, and the majority who've responded to this thread are castigating them for it.
laffin' some more
Not true, these open carry demonstrators do NOT have a Legal or Constitution Right to carry on Private Property if the owned says "No Guns Allowed". It's not that hard to understand...
Except that THAT'S not what they are being castigated for here...they are being derided here simply for the open carrying of their firearms in public, period.
Except that THAT'S not what they are being castigated for here...they are being derided here simply for the open carrying of their firearms in public, period.
- - - Like I mentioned earlier, we don't see any public antics out of the gay community - - -
I don't know where sherp hangs out, but for any who go to most cities, beaches, amusement parks, etc. his statement is a roaring joke. Homosexual PDA of rather extreme sorts is all too common, planned demonstrations are obvious - and the rest is topped off with the "pride" parades, dykes on bikes, queers with dears, etc.. Once subject to that ugliness, a normal person tends to get their theme.
What if they were black, dreds, buttcrack pants, beret hat, Africa flag on they back, looking hard everywhere and at you? Just curious. How would you deal with it?
- - - Like I mentioned earlier, we don't see any public antics out of the gay community - - -
I don't know where sherp hangs out, but for any who go to most cities, beaches, amusement parks, etc. his statement is a roaring joke. Homosexual PDA of rather extreme sorts is all too common, planned demonstrations are obvious - and the rest is topped off with the "pride" parades, dykes on bikes, queers with dears, etc.. Once subject to that ugliness, a normal person tends to get their theme.
That is a crock! You are describing gun owners as has been pointed out by so many members here. Why else do you think firearms are on the radar of politicians so much?
Meanwhile, homosexuals finally learned in the last few decades about how flaunting their lifestyle down through the centuries and trying to ram it down everyone's throats had not been working and started being more low key....even secretive. Since they started doing that tactic, politicians have been much more open to rewarding them with more privileges. Sheeez, get with the [bleep] program and pay attention to how things work.
What if they were black, dreds, buttcrack pants, beret hat, Africa flag on they back, looking hard everywhere and at you? Just curious. How would you deal with it?
Quote
While I oppose what they are doing, none of them seem to be looking hard at anyone or anything.
In Tennessee a store owner can place a sign restricting carry of any kind. Most of us want concealed carry but open carry can cost us business. No matter how much we support the right to carry, profit is the only thing that keeps the doors open.
Joe The Plumber makes an ill-timed 'comment' about his gun rights, and the majority who've responded to that thread are supportive of him.
These guys carrying their guns are actually exercising those same rights that Joe The Plumber was just giving lip service to, and the majority who've responded to this thread are castigating them for it.
laffin' some more
Not true, these open carry demonstrators do NOT have a Legal or Constitution Right to carry on Private Property if the owned says "No Guns Allowed". It's not that hard to understand...
Except that THAT'S not what they are being castigated for here...they are being derided here simply for the open carrying of their firearms in public, period.
still laffin'
HUH, this is about Sonic not wanting open carry long guns inside their restaurant.
This started in Texas, where Open carry of a handgun is illegal. Open carry of a long gun is legal in Texas, where where these knuckleheads denied their right to carry in public and why is Sonic being blamed for State Law?
- - - Like I mentioned earlier, we don't see any public antics out of the gay community - - -
I don't know where sherp hangs out, but for any who go to most cities, beaches, amusement parks, etc. his statement is a roaring joke. Homosexual PDA of rather extreme sorts is all too common, planned demonstrations are obvious - and the rest is topped off with the "pride" parades, dykes on bikes, queers with dears, etc.. Once subject to that ugliness, a normal person tends to get their theme.
That is a crock! You are describing gun owners as has been pointed out by so many members here. Why else do you think firearms are on the radar of politicians so much?
Meanwhile, homosexuals finally learned in the last few decades about how flaunting their lifestyle down through the centuries and trying to ram it down everyone's throats had not been working and started being more low key....even secretive. Since they started doing that tactic, politicians have been much more open to rewarding them with more privileges. Sheeez, get with the [bleep] program and pay attention to how things work.
Sherp - one has to hope that you are not the idiot that you present here. Plant yourself along the parade route in SF or any of the other homosexual behavior friendly cities where the homosexuals regularly demonstrate their "pride" (that is, if you can handle such a dose). Be careful crossing the intersections so you don't get smacked by a Harley sporting a "dykes on bykes" sign - you might drop your crock and break it. You are not fooling anyone who has even a bit of experience seeing that stuff. Get real.
That is a crock! You are describing gun owners as has been pointed out by so many members here. Why else do you think firearms are on the radar of politicians so much?
Meanwhile, homosexuals finally learned in the last few decades about how flaunting their lifestyle down through the centuries and trying to ram it down everyone's throats had not been working and started being more low key....even secretive. Since they started doing that tactic, politicians have been much more open to rewarding them with more privileges. Sheeez, get with the [bleep] program and pay attention to how things work.
Sherp - one has to hope that you are not the idiot that you present here. Plant yourself along the parade route in SF or any of the other homosexual behavior friendly cities where the homosexuals regularly demonstrate their "pride" (that is, if you can handle such a dose). Be careful crossing the intersections so you don't get smacked by a Harley sporting a "dykes on bykes" sign - you might drop your crock and break it. You are not fooling anyone who has even a bit of experience seeing that stuff. Get real.
So you travel around as a spectator at these gay parades?
I didn't want to but it was the only place around for about fifty miles. And I'm to the right of Attila the Hun and about as far from a Demonrat as one could get!
Let's see, of the $12 we spent, how much of that do you think will go to the Dems? For me, going there with a CCW was also sort of a poke in the eye to the the corporate idiots. You can take it however you want!
That is a crock! You are describing gun owners as has been pointed out by so many members here. Why else do you think firearms are on the radar of politicians so much?
Meanwhile, homosexuals finally learned in the last few decades about how flaunting their lifestyle down through the centuries and trying to ram it down everyone's throats had not been working and started being more low key....even secretive. Since they started doing that tactic, politicians have been much more open to rewarding them with more privileges. Sheeez, get with the [bleep] program and pay attention to how things work.
Sherp - one has to hope that you are not the idiot that you present here. Plant yourself along the parade route in SF or any of the other homosexual behavior friendly cities where the homosexuals regularly demonstrate their "pride" (that is, if you can handle such a dose). Be careful crossing the intersections so you don't get smacked by a Harley sporting a "dykes on bykes" sign - you might drop your crock and break it. You are not fooling anyone who has even a bit of experience seeing that stuff. Get real.
So you travel around as a spectator at these gay parades?
No need to travel - no need to look for them - they are everywhere. Messes up the traffic patterns - nuisance for us truck drivers.
That is a crock! You are describing gun owners as has been pointed out by so many members here. Why else do you think firearms are on the radar of politicians so much?
Meanwhile, homosexuals finally learned in the last few decades about how flaunting their lifestyle down through the centuries and trying to ram it down everyone's throats had not been working and started being more low key....even secretive. Since they started doing that tactic, politicians have been much more open to rewarding them with more privileges. Sheeez, get with the [bleep] program and pay attention to how things work.
Sherp - one has to hope that you are not the idiot that you present here. Plant yourself along the parade route in SF or any of the other homosexual behavior friendly cities where the homosexuals regularly demonstrate their "pride" (that is, if you can handle such a dose). Be careful crossing the intersections so you don't get smacked by a Harley sporting a "dykes on bykes" sign - you might drop your crock and break it. You are not fooling anyone who has even a bit of experience seeing that stuff. Get real.
So you travel around as a spectator at these gay parades?
No need to travel - no need to look for them - they are everywhere. Messes up the traffic patterns - nuisance for us truck drivers.
Why that just can't be! Otherwise they would be getting fewer privileges instead of more!
Well I see this is still going I must say there are radical wacks every where both pro gun and anti gun yes a few of the pro's are here , lack of common sense on both sides when the [bleep] storm clears hope level heads prevail on both sides
What if they were black, dreds, buttcrack pants, beret hat, Africa flag on they back, looking hard everywhere and at you? Just curious. How would you deal with it?
Of the guns shown in the photograph of the guys carrying, I see one one carried in a safe manner, the bolt rifle in th foreground. I see at least two pointed horizontally and one apparently pointed at the ground at an angle. Ain't no way sooner or later one of those muzzles are going to sweep someone, or multiple someones.
�We are heartened that we can take our children to these family-oriented restaurants and not worry about being confronted by customers with semiautomatic rifles,� Shannon Watts, founder of Moms Demand Action for Gun Sense in America, said in a statement Friday in response to the new Sonic policy on guns.
Huh ???? What ????
Is she kidding ????
And will she be disheartened when someone's family member is killed by ANY type of firearm carried by someone who doesn't give a rat's ass about the restaurants' policies ????
Bet you a dollar to a doughnut someone is going to wish someone was carrying and was able to put the piece of [bleep] who didn't give a rat's ass away.
Thinking thru this earlier that's what bugged me most. Don't make much sense to me to be carrying a rifle in a ice cream store but I understand the point they're making. Still, the muzzle control issue is guaranteed to bring about a discussion or two when they sweep the wrong guy. Pro-gun or not.
Of the guns shown in the photograph of the guys carrying, I see one one carried in a safe manner, the bolt rifle in th foreground. I see at least two pointed horizontally and one apparently pointed at the ground at an angle. Ain't no way sooner or later one of those muzzles are going to sweep someone, or multiple someones.
I don't like being swept with a muzzle.
Just sayin.
Straight up and down isn't safe either...2nd floors, airplanes, and gravity guarantee the bullet will hit somewhere. In fact, in to the ground is much safer since most of the energy from a accidental will get expended in to the ground.
Out of curiosity, since you mentioned the muzzle under the table was going to sweep you, how often do you crawl around under folks' tables and why? Lying in wait in case they drop something, perving on women/little girls wearing skirts, or just a thrill seeker? Sounds like a good way to get your ass kicked.
I personally don't think open carry in public businesses help the Gun Owners in the long run. If i was going to rob a place the first person i would take out would be the ones who were carrying in the open .
(Playing devil's advocate here) But what if ALL customers are carrying openly? You got enough ammo and speed to take out 50+ customers before ya rob the place?
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Why set yourself up as a target .
Maybe the sight of a customer carrying would actually scare off a potential crook.
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If you are going to carry then conceal the weapon.
Knives are considered weapons and are most often carried in a sheath on the belt. Does that make you a target too?
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Open carry in the woods and fields is a whole different ball game .
Not really. One can run into a crook there too - or a rabid bunny-hugger who views your firearm as owned by a 'violent' hunter and makes the carrier a 'target' too..
Decisions, decisions, Socialist Charlie (Socialist Emeritus), TRH (KOTY Emeritus) and DD (Dumbass Emeritus) have all the options covered, meaning I can't take a position on the subject...rats.
�We are heartened that we can take our children to these family-oriented restaurants and not worry about being confronted by customers with semiautomatic rifles,� Shannon Watts, founder of Moms Demand Action for Gun Sense in America, said in a statement Friday in response to the new Sonic policy on guns.
Huh ???? What ????
Is she kidding ????
No, ML, she's a liberal - and predisposed to gun-idiocy..
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And will she be disheartened when someone's family member is killed by ANY type of firearm carried by someone who doesn't give a rat's ass about the restaurants' policies ????
Not disheartened, but even more dedicated to anti-gun policies; policies that do NOTHING, I repeat, NOTHING to prevent that type of crime..
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Bet you a dollar to a doughnut someone is going to wish someone was carrying and was able to put the piece of [bleep] who didn't give a rat's ass away.
Another winner, DUHHHHHHHHH
I wouldn't take that bet, ML.. Because I think you're dead (PUN!) on...
And - as to Sonic - they can KMA... I have always wanted to go to one (there's a Sonic just west of me about 35 miles) but now I'll pass..
I've ate at Sonic since I was a little kid. Oftentimes they are the only option in small towns where even Mickey D's fears to tread. I guess they are to be commended for that, but their food sucks and holds no mysteries for me.
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