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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 31,079 Likes: 4
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 31,079 Likes: 4 |
I don't know the facts in this case, but I'd lay 10-1 odds for a substantial amount of money, that the deceased was not out for a jog. You could very well be right. But, from what you saw on the video did the black jogger have the right to resist being accosted and cut off by the gun wielding person? I was accosted by a team of men, all armed, demanding I stop and talk to them, tell them what I'm doing in the neighborhood, where I live, etc.. I was taking my typical evening stroll, and I was a few blocks from my home. I guess it was more than ten years ago. Quite dark out. I turned a corner, and from four blocks away I saw bright headlights lighting me up, to the point I was blinded by them. I decided to go one block further before turning south, so as to avoid walking into these bright lights. However, then I heard tires screeching, and the headlights were quickly barreling down on my location ... two or three vehicles (been a while, so I can't remember which). As they bore down on me, I quickly stepped off the road onto the grass of someone's home, hoping to avoid being run down. The vehicles all stopped in front of me, and several men came out with guns, charged at me demanding I identify myself, and why I was out walking in this area. They also demanded my address, and wanted to know why I suddenly changed direction when I saw their vehicles a few blocks away. I told them all the answers to their questions, including why I changed direction, and they all came over, smiled, shook my hand, and apologized if they startled me . They were all uniformed cops, in marked patrol vehicles, looking for a criminal last seen in the area. Your comparison of your incident with the "jogger" incident in question is basically comparing apples and space rocks. You quoted me and left out the very pertinent part of my question which described the people accosting said "jogger" as "civilian and non law enforcement". Sort of dishonest to quote a person out of context if the part you leave out changes the question in a major way. I don't mind out of context if the most important thrust of the question is not omitted. Reminds me of a situation I was in many years ago when I was a freshman in college, selling books door-to-door in Mississippi. I turned down a cul-de-sac and as I turned around, two vehicles blocked my exit. Fortunately I was able to talk my way out of it, but I expected half expected I as going to find out just how accurate the literature regarding the effectiveness of the .357 Magnum, 125gr Winchester Silvertip as a man stopper really was. I would of felt a lot more comfortable if I had to shoot these boys in Wyoming. I'd committed no offense, so, regardless, I was ready to do what ever it took, but things sure could of got messy. Perhaps the fact that I was a white boy with Wyoming plates helped, but for different folks, it could of played out much differently.
You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.
You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,946 Likes: 5
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,946 Likes: 5 |
You're lazy. Just say that you're lazy.
OK, I’m lazy. Overall, I was doing pretty good until the Big D (divorce not dik if you was gonna go there) A $6,000 motorcycle would set me back about three or four months in paying off debt. Three or four months ain’t very long unless you got maybe seven years until retirement to get everything else done IF yer lucky. I REALLY wanna clear this debt. End of this year it’s gone, start making payment on a new/newer vehicle while also in another 18 months paying off the house note That’s the plan. You kids think you’re gonna live forever. Some day when you’re older son you might understand 🙂 I AM sure you’re gonna keep track of my finances..... 
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,946 Likes: 5
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 37,946 Likes: 5 |
So . . . . . . . . . . . your one of the people that I see how close I can get my mirror to without actually dinging them? I try not to be, I ride with the attitude that if I ever get hit it’s ALWAYS gonna be my fault, for being out there on a bicycle in the first place. Meanwhile go ahead and play bicyclist chicken if ya want, Jesus don’t care how you treat folks and you don’t got enough legal hassles anyhow..
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,097
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,097 |
Defense doesn’t have to prove that. Open carry in Georgia is legal. It’s legal to ask someone to stop and talk on the street. It’s legal to do it while holding a firearm...
Legal Open carry is one thing, trying to justify citizens arrest is another. DA Barnhills letter to Cpt. Tom Jump indicates they were not just trying to talk to Arbery, but commanded him To Stop, with aid of road block and firearm.
.. Prosecution is going to need to show that he pointed the shotgun at the jogger or verbally threatened him.
The police report of the incident states Travis McMichael pointed the shotgun at Arbery. where would LE get such details... quite possibly the defendant himself told them that, .. otherwise how would they know?
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,097
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,097 |
.. It’s legal to ask someone to stop and talk on the street. It’s legal to do it while holding a firearm...
You said you don't do 'fiction', yet you make it sound like the McMichaels were only trying to have a friendly neighborhood watch chat with Arbery on a voluntary basis. It was nothing of that sort...McMichaels by their own admission were conducting a forced stop citizens arrest. Based on highly dubious 'first hand solid probable cause'.
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,097
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,097 |
No, no, no, JoeBob. The experts here have officially declared both hillbillies were ‘brandishing’ their open-carry firearms.
The video does not show that, but the experts just filled in the blanks...
are you suggesting the police report stating that Mic. Jnr pointed the weapon at Arbery, got the details wrong?.. . .or they fabricated the details? Do you know for certain that Mic Jnr did not brandish the weapon in an intimidating manner before actually pointing it at Arbery? Is it reasonably possibly Jnr. brandished the gun as they shouted STOP! to try and effect a citizens Arrest,.. which caused Arbery to turn and respond to the near threat?.. Then have Jnr. point the gun directly at him?
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,435
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2005
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I do NOT know who did what, at the front of the vehicle......neither do you. Video does NOT show everything, as some like to say. How can you fill in the blanks, for a conviction? Didn’t want the kid killed. Get no pleasure from it. The incident with the hillbillies may not be acceptable, but perhaps understandable. Folks are tired of other’s stealing their hard-earned stuff. No, no, no, JoeBob. The experts here have officially declared both hillbillies were ‘brandishing’ their open-carry firearms.
The video does not show that, but the experts just filled in the blanks...
are you suggesting the police report stating that Mic. Jnr pointed the weapon at Arbery, got the details wrong?.. . .or they fabricated the details? Do you know for certain that Mic Jnr did not brandish the weapon in an intimidating manner before actually pointing it at Arbery? Is it reasonably possibly Jnr. brandished the gun as they shouted STOP! to try and effect a citizens Arrest,.. which caused Arbery to turn and respond to the near threat?.. Then have Jnr. point the gun directly at him?
"Those that think they know everything are annoying those of us that have Google." - Dr. D. Edward Wilkinson
Note to self: Never ask an old Fogey how he is doing today.
Revised note to self: Keep it short when someone asks how I am doing.
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,625 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,625 Likes: 2 |
I do NOT know who did what, at the front of the vehicle......neither do you. Video does NOT show everything, as some like to say.
How can you fill in the blanks, for a conviction?
Didn’t want the kid killed. Get no pleasure from it.
The incident with the hillbillies may not be acceptable, but perhaps understandable.
Folks are tired of other’s stealing their hard-earned stuff.
Yep, it has become that way around here, law don't do sheit, never catch anybody except the speeders going to work, only concerned about the revenue stream.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 11,515 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 11,515 Likes: 2 |
The incident with the hillbillies may not be acceptable, but perhaps understandable.
Folks are tired of other’s stealing their hard-earned stuff.
Can you read? A few posts ago? The guy who Dumb and Dumber claimed had stuff stolen says he had nothing stolen! Duh!
Don't blame me. I voted for Trump.
Democrats would burn this country to the ground, if they could rule over the ashes.
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,815 Likes: 5
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,815 Likes: 5 |
.. It’s legal to ask someone to stop and talk on the street. It’s legal to do it while holding a firearm...
You said you don't do 'fiction', yet you make it sound like the McMichaels were only trying to have a friendly neighborhood watch chat with Arbery on a voluntary basis. It was nothing of that sort...McMichaels by their own admission were conducting a forced stop citizens arrest. Based on highly dubious 'first hand solid probable cause'. By their own admission? I haven’t seen admissions from the McMichaels or statements of any kind. All I’ve seen is an officer's summary. Those are frequently highly condensed and sometimes, just wrong.
Last edited by JoeBob; 05/11/20.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
You're lazy. Just say that you're lazy.
OK, I’m lazy. Thank you.
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Can you read? A few posts ago? The guy who Dumb and Dumber claimed had stuff stolen says he had nothing stolen! Duh!
![[Linked Image from media.giphy.com]](https://media.giphy.com/media/GpyS1lJXJYupG/giphy.gif)
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,747 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,747 Likes: 2 |
This is one of those times when I'm ashamed to be associated with this forum.
I'm afraid that someday, someone will see I posted on the same forum as a bunch of slack-jawed morons who immediately screamed "RACISTS" about the McMichael's.
Politics is War by Other Means
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Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 5,182 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 5,182 Likes: 1 |
No, no, no, JoeBob. The experts here have officially declared both hillbillies were ‘brandishing’ their open-carry firearms.
The video does not show that, but the experts just filled in the blanks...
are you suggesting the police report stating that Mic. Jnr pointed the weapon at Arbery, got the details wrong?.. . .or they fabricated the details? Do you know for certain that Mic Jnr did not brandish the weapon in an intimidating manner before actually pointing it at Arbery? Is it reasonably possibly Jnr. brandished the gun as they shouted STOP! to try and effect a citizens Arrest,.. which caused Arbery to turn and respond to the near threat?.. Then have Jnr. point the gun directly at him? If Jr had the gun pointed at the Arbery wouldn't Arbery of been shot when he ran around the front of the truck? Arbery saw Jr at the front drivers side of the truck and went around to the passenger side giving Jr plenty of time to get ready for a kill shot. There's no question the negro would of still been alive to rape and pillage if he'd of just kept running. It's also true if father and son wouldn’t of confronted the Arbery he'd also still be alive. But the more you learn about Arbery the more it's apparent he needed killing.
Life is good live it while you can.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
This is one of those times when I'm ashamed to be associated with this forum.
I'm afraid that someday, someone will see I posted on the same forum as a bunch of slack-jawed morons who immediately screamed "RACISTS" about the McMichael's. The funniest thing is a bunch of gun owning homeowners saying overtly racist schit on the internets. They best pray they never have to wrassle with a jogger themselves. LOL
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 5,182 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 5,182 Likes: 1 |
The incident with the hillbillies may not be acceptable, but perhaps understandable.
Folks are tired of other’s stealing their hard-earned stuff.
Can you read? A few posts ago? The guy who Dumb and Dumber claimed had stuff stolen says he had nothing stolen! Duh! From reports he got caught inside the house before he could steal anything and took off running. Anyone with half a brain knows he wasn't out for a afternoon jog. Common sense isn't very common any more.
Life is good live it while you can.
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Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,747 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,747 Likes: 2 |
Your comparison of your incident with the "jogger" incident in question is basically comparing apples and space rocks. You quoted me and left out the very pertinent part of my question which described the people accosting said "jogger" as "civilian and non law enforcement". Sort of dishonest to quote a person out of context if the part you leave out changes the question in a major way. I don't mind out of context if the most important thrust of the question is not omitted. Actually, cops are civilians. They are not part of the military and they technically have no more rights than you or I. You & I have just as much ability to enforce the law. You can even write a cop a ticket for speeding. Or maybe I missed the part about LE being a separate branch in the Constitution.
Politics is War by Other Means
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Actually, cops are civilians. They are not part of the military and they technically have no more rights than you or I. You & I have just as much ability to enforce the law.
Or maybe I missed the part about LE being a separate branch in the Constitution.
I'm not sure what you're citing here but it's very far from accurate.
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,774
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,774 |
The incident with the hillbillies may not be acceptable, but perhaps understandable.
Folks are tired of other’s stealing their hard-earned stuff.
Can you read? A few posts ago? The guy who Dumb and Dumber claimed had stuff stolen says he had nothing stolen! Duh! From reports he got caught inside the house before he could steal anything and took off running. Anyone with half a brain knows he wasn't out for a afternoon jog. Common sense isn't very common any more. Not sure I agree. Plenty of people on here "knows he wasn't out for a jog" and they got less than half a brain. Some of you much less than half.
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Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,747 Likes: 2
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 14,747 Likes: 2 |
Actually, cops are civilians. They are not part of the military and they technically have no more rights than you or I. You & I have just as much ability to enforce the law.
Or maybe I missed the part about LE being a separate branch in the Constitution.
I'm not sure what you're citing here but it's very far from accurate. What part is inaccurate? If they aren't civilians are they military? Royalty? Nope. You can cite a cop for breaking the law too. The executive branch is civilian. There basically was no LE until about 1850. You had ATF collecting taxes earlier and sheriffs, but that's about it.
Last edited by Tyrone; 05/11/20.
Politics is War by Other Means
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