Home Forums Reloading Handgun Reloading Crimp enlightenment

Ok, I could use some enlightening I guess. All this talk about factory crimp dies has me wondering. I've never used one. For 50 years I've been loading cast bullets in revolver ammo, everything from .32's to .45's. My protocol has been to crimp with the seating dies into the crimping grooves on the bullets. Never a worry, never a hiccup, never a thought that there's a better way. (Of course I employ taper crimp dies for autoloading ammo.) Am I truly missing something? Do I need to order a sh*tload of FCD's?😁

I normally employ rather light crimps, just enough to get away with - just enough to keep bullets from backing out, with a nod toward complete powder burn where necessary.

What, you haven't bought into the shaved bullet, whatever your case length, bulge ironing phuggup fixers yet?

I just use them with the bulge buster kit for my 10mm 1911's. Don't use them to crimp with.

I tried the LEE Factory Crimp Die on .44 Special once, didn't see any advantage to it. I went back to crimping with the seating die, like I've been doing for the past 50yrs.

I'm stuck in the past, evidently. How did I ever successfully load so many thousands of revolver bullets with just an RCBS seating die?

I use roll crimps, taper crimps, and the Lee FCD..

I sometimes seat and crimp in one step, sometimes as separate steps.

I like it all.

If I ever see a tool for stab crimping in a dusty old gun shop I might buy it and try that too.

Haven't tried loading shot shells yet. I bet there's crimping galore waiting there!

:⁠-⁠)

Get the military roll crimp from Ballistic Products over their standard roll crimper.

A shell vise helps.

If you seat only, no crimp, then change to a profile or taper crimp die, with all of your handguns, revolver, single shot or auto, plus use the same mfg of brass and prepare that brass for each gun, you will see an improvement in accuracy. Throwing junk together is for the clay pit, shooting cans at 10 feet. No matter how you pray over junk, it will still be junk.

No idea how far you may travel to shoot or to compete in a match. However, reloading, traveling and then just shooting junk, makes absolutely no sense.

With cast you size to the groove diameter or no more than .001 over. You use quality lube. You also cast with your alloy, an alloy that is made of consistent components, each measured by weight and that throws fully filled out bullets, with consistent bullet weights. The alloy should be made in at least 100# lots for consistency.

Consistency in any and every step is required if you want to shoot in matches of any size, or to anchieve the very best accuracy you can possibly achieve, especially shooting cast bullets against jacketed bullets in a mach.

You're not missing anything. Folks just tend to find something that works for their needs and they roll with it. If keeping up with the Joneses was all that mattered I wouldn't still be using half the stuff I bought back in the 80's and 90's.

I do however like the non-carbide ring lee factory crimp die for quite a few levergun and pistol applications.

Uh, nope. What determines size is throat diameter. That's not me talking out my arse, it's been proven time and again by better men than me over the last half-century and I've adopted that protocol based on my own experimentation. If a revolver's throats are wonky then it's time to have them honed. Several smiths around the country make a living doing that, which tells me there's been a lot of folks who've woken up to that little fact of life.

Case in point: I recently acquired a 100 year old Colt Army Special .32-20. Groove diameter is .312, throats are a heavy .314. Out of curiosity I loaded some .313 bullets I had on hand (more like .3125") - because I was too lazy to cast another batch and size/lube as-cast at .314. Accuracy was mediocre and a mere boxful leaded fairly badly, even though I was .001" over groove diameter. Followed up by casting a fresh batch, same alloy, same lube, same everything else and those .314's delivered great accuracy with zero leading. Thousandths of an inch matter, and can sometimes matter a lot.

The same holds true in rifles. You'd be surprised how throat dimensions vary in relation to bore dimensions, and how easy it is to achieve accuracy goals by minding that little factoid. Another example: One of my Krags has grooves .309 but its throat is a whopping .312. .309-.310's whistle Dixie but .312 bullets sing like Pavarotti.

My 375 Win is like that... .375 bore, but with the throat it prefers fatter cast. .376/377 shoot ok, but it really comes to life with .378 bullets.

Depends on what you shoot. The Lee Collet and Lee FCD are excellent tools to have available if you need them.

I shoot 300gr WFN 44Mag @1000fps out of a M329pd. I need max neck tension and a super crimp to keep those bullets from pulling. For me, the Lee Collet is the best solution.

https://sites.google.com/site/hobbyhintstricksideas/home/crimping-44-magnum

I guess I don't care. Folks can do what they please for the reason that pleases them. I use the FCD in my large bore handguns (think stout 45 Colt, 475 Linebaugh and 500 Linebaugh). My 348 Win gets them as well. I really don't see an issue with what one chooses.

revolvers roll crimp. many times I do this in one process of seating the bullet. if I'm loading something I'm really chasing the accuracy I will do it in two processes.

automatic pistol cartridges use the Lee factory crimp die for a good taper crimp.
tubular magazine rifles roll crimp

30-06 and below recoil level no crimp

larger gun start applying some crimp generally a roll crimp

I adopted separate seating and crimping steps long ago whether using a roll crimp or a taper crimp. It just works and there are no slivers of shaved bullet or any of that silliness.

HOWEVER...I recently acquired a couple of 9mm pistols after selling off another pair. My intent originally was to bail on 9mm all together but instead, a set of dies and a few thousand bullets showed up on the doorstep after the two new pistols made their appearance. Best laid plans---ha! I didn't even get close...

Anyway, I had a bunch of range brass I've collected over the years to use, so I developed a load and tested it in my wife's new P10-C. It worked well. I loaded up a hundred more rounds using the same range brass to further test in both a new-to-me K9 and her P10C. As I said, it had all worked beautifully in the P10C but I thought it a good idea to run all the ammo through the plunk test in my K9...and there were issues which indicated a Lee FCD might be helpful.

I ordered a Lee FCD for 9mm, removed the case mouth crimp collet, and ran all 100 rounds through the FCD. I did not remove the barrel from the K9 for the plunk test, I just manually cycled 4 magazines fully loaded through the gun and everything was kosher. Failure to chamber and go into battery had been about 50% until running the loaded rounds through the FCD.

This is one use of the LEE FCD that I think is legit. IMO, the taper crimp applied by a conventional RCBS seater is perfectly satisfactory...in fact, I can see use of the Lee FCD on the case mouth as potentially detrimental and there's no good reason to do it. If you think you need a better crimp or more crimp than a conventional die provides, then I think you actually have a sizing die problem. The taper crimp should just remove any of the flare applied to the case mouth to facilitate starting the bullet...that's all it's meant to do.

I think the effectiveness of the FCD in my case was due to the inability to run a fired case deeply enough into my RCBS carbide sizing die to reduce any bulge in the case down near the web. That's what the FCD can do better than any other die that I know of, and that makes me wonder why sizing dies in general are not designed to resize all the way to the web as the FCD can do.

If you think you might get better accuracy using the FCD to tighten up case outh crimp, then maybe you should play with the FCD for that reason. The only other reason I can see to use one is to correct the situation I just dealt with.

YMMV.

I found if you are running over sized bullets in a handgun, whether it is the throat diameter or bore diameter. FCD will crimp those bullets back to modern factory specs defeating the purpose.This happened to me in an old 38-40 rifle and a 1906 Colt single action.

I tried the FCD with 9 mm and 45 ACP and saw no difference.

I don't shoot competition anymore, but never crimped rifle loads and used the roll crimp in the dies either a Dillon Square Deal or RCBS.Probably been loading longer than most on here.

I knock the carbide ring out. I shoot .432" in my .44 Mag but like the tolerance of case length the FCD has, so the ring had to go.

Obviously, I seat and crimp in separate operations.

Exactly.

After 50 years you don't know, then it sounds like you need to find something else to occupy your time.

Still flapping that dickhole. lol