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Given the death and destruction, fear and agony, experienced by those men, why would anyone want a physical memento of the event? I understand the history, but I couldn’t look at those items without thinking of the physical and emotional anguish and horror felt by those who fought and died there. P Another good point. Many reasons for the fascination. For me it was always a way of connecting with those participants, to identify with them maybe, by being able to hold tangible relics of their existence in my hands. Kind of the same as my maintaining a tie with my long gone grandfather by using his tools whenever I can. I get the connection to history, but I can’t help but imagine what was going on in the young man’s mind who owned the artifact. Did he die, calling out in his last moment, for his mother? Was he out of his mind with self-preservation, fighting hand to hand with some other poor kid, both wanting nothing more than to go home? A piece of the wall, never forget, I can understand. Holding a piece of a bayonet that could have been used to rip the life from a boy (and from his mom, too, when she got word) is too much. P
Obey lawful commands. Video interactions. Hold bad cops accountable. Problem solved.
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
Member #547 Join date 3/09/2001
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I really don’t like to admit when I’m wrong. I’m on record here and a few other spots saying that we were taught this through revisionist history. Lincoln relieved 3 Union commanders between the beginning of the war up until Antietam for declaring that slaves were to be freed in their districts! Slavery was admittedly a big fish in a small pond. The first 7 states to secede were cotton belt states, where slavery paid better. But the North went to war for union, not slavery! Hell, it was proven!😀 But if you don’t learn as you age, you might as well be dead! 😳 Little Mac is the guy who built the AOTP, and a pretty good general to boot. But he was always hesitant to fight his army, believing he was outnumbered 2 to 1. Mac was a staunch Democrat. He believed slavery was protected under the Constitution, and it was! As a victorious commander, he was a shoe in for the White House! A deadly political rival to Republicans who were controlling the government and the war. Many of them were abolitionist, if not publicly, at least in the closet! I believe that Mac was fed false information to keep him from winning the war early. It took time to work slavery as a war objective and he was backstabbed by the administration as a result. The war was eventually fought and won by apolitical generals, who were not gonna pose a threat as rivals. When you visit the Gettysburg Visitors Center, you are funneled through a 45 minute film where Morgan Freeman explains to you that the war was fought over slavery. If you wanna see the Cyclorama and the museum, it’s part of the package! Myself, I freakin hate it. Gettysburg is my second home, and I put boots on the ground. Like I said, if you know the history, the ground will guide the tour itself! I hate to admit it, but the north went to war to free the slaves! Even though it wasn’t revealed until a year and a half later! Even in the 1860s, things were not as they seemed. An important lesson for the 2020s! Do you honestly believe we’re sending billions to Ukraine to defend democracy?🤬 Reon
Last edited by 7mmbuster; 05/07/24.
"Preserving the Constitution, fighting off the nibblers and chippers, even nibblers and chippers with good intentions, was once regarded by conservatives as the first duty of the citizen. It still is." � Wesley Pruden
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Heck, I’m now over 1.2 post a day on here! It took over 20 years to get this high. L😳 Youn’s that know me will recognize that the vast majority is multiple post on threads about history, where I usually know what I’m posting about!😀 Not always, but pretty close!😀 Most of the time I’ll grudgingly admit when I’m wrong.🤬 And I do here. Almost always on threads like this, I learn stuff that I hadn’t known before, and this thread is no exception. Many times I have come here seeking advice about guns, reloading and muzzle loaders. Other times I’m sharing my vast knowledge of history and shooting my mouth off about something or other. Over 20 years! I made a pile of friends, and maybe an enemy or two. Heck I’m always right, most of the time!😀 Anyway, I love stuff like this, and I realize that me and most of you others owe the Rickster a debt that we can never repay!😎 Across 50 states and a couple of continents. We have a home and a family that we’ll probably never meet. So I’ll say it! Thanks Rick!
"Preserving the Constitution, fighting off the nibblers and chippers, even nibblers and chippers with good intentions, was once regarded by conservatives as the first duty of the citizen. It still is." � Wesley Pruden
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I was in the service, but I never got shot at or saw a shot fired in anger. Growing up, I was much closer to Dad than Mom. But reading history, you always hear of guys with their guts shot out crying for their Mom or their wives! I’m I have two failed marriages under my belt. I’m think men marry women expecting them to never change, and women marrying men expecting them to change! They change but we don’t, or at least we can’t see it! That’s as close as I’ll try to get to explaining life!😀 I guess it’s only natural for a man, close to death, to call for the ladies who gave them life and cared for them. It sucks, but we’re helpless without them!😀 Though Carol and Penny seemed to change, I wouldn’t trade a second of having them in my life, and my Mom was absolutely the most wonderful lady to ever draw a breath of air.I’m sure!😎 Besides who in their right mind can look at another guys hairy but and think yeah???!!!😀
Last edited by 7mmbuster; 05/07/24.
"Preserving the Constitution, fighting off the nibblers and chippers, even nibblers and chippers with good intentions, was once regarded by conservatives as the first duty of the citizen. It still is." � Wesley Pruden
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In their right mind being the key phrase, of course.
P
Obey lawful commands. Video interactions. Hold bad cops accountable. Problem solved.
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
Member #547 Join date 3/09/2001
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While in the area, a few other early American sights. Colonial Williamsburg…
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Campfire Ranger
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While in Williamsburg, informal lunch/beer at Chowning's Tavern (pronounced "Chewning's), more refined dining at King's Arms. Neither will disappoint. (My ex and I got married in Williamsburg and hosted our reception at King's Arms. Cost enough to finance a couple custom rifles, and note I said "ex"!)
"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz "Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
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Flew over it on the way home from FL three weeks ago and have visited it on the ground. Shocking how small it is as a battlefield. It's in the bottom right of the picture I took.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
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Small in terms of what's preserved today. Private property/houses encompasses the bulk of the actual battlefield. Still, it sealed the fate of our Nation-To-Be.
"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz "Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
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Small in terms of what's preserved today. Private property/houses encompasses the bulk of the actual battlefield. Still, it sealed the fate of our Nation-To-Be. True - Very desirable property in a lovely location. I'm not sure when we got serious about preserving our battlefields from encroachment.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
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Campfire Ranger
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Gotta go see the ships at Jamestown
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Campfire Ranger
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Small in terms of what's preserved today. Private property/houses encompasses the bulk of the actual battlefield. Still, it sealed the fate of our Nation-To-Be. True - Very desirable property in a lovely location. I'm not sure when we got serious about preserving our battlefields from encroachment. Started in the 1930's but didn't get aggressive until the 1960's and by then it was largely too late. Still an ongoing fight, physically, morally, ethically - usually decided by who has the deeper pockets, Feds or developers, and how boisterous the people are both pro and con. Directly in front of the visitor center at Antietam there sits a small brick ranch house on a small pocket of private property. The Feds have been trying to acquire it since the late 60's when the property slipped past everybody's noses and a local guy built the house. They reached an agreement that if/when the owner passes away the property reverts to the NPS at "fair market value". I know this because my old metal detecting/shooting buddy's dad built the house and my old buddy lives in it now even though his mom and dad passed away years ago. He weaseled his way in through a loophole, and has vowed to stay there until hell freezes over, essentially just to thumb his nose at the Feds. Right or wrong, there it is. In the 70's I metal detected the then privately owned fields that lie to the west of the Hagerstown Pike, found a ton of minie balls and the like of course. Since then that land has been folded into the Antietam National Battlefield Park and such activity will now result in an insane fine. Right or wrong, there you have that too. I've been chastised by "professional" archaeologists for metal detecting (I haven't in a loooong time now, and always stayed on private property, mostly in obscure locations that Park Service archaeologists never thought to take notice of), that I/we should've left the stuff in the ground for posterity and possible future archaeology. Meh, I always rejoined them - how much of that work has been actually done and what are the real world chances of it ever being done? I was treated to silence as they recognized my point. At least, said I, someone was retrieving the stuff while it could be gotten.
"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz "Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
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Completely off topic.
Shrapnel, How did you enjoy the humidity the last few mornings?
Here is hoping all summer isn’t nuts stuck to my leg!
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
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Completely off topic.
Shrapnel, How did you enjoy the humidity the last few mornings?
Here is hoping all summer isn’t nuts stuck to my leg! Holy Crap, I am sitting in the shade behind a 7 11 with the air conditioning on full blast. We went to Colonial Williamsburg this morning and I nearly faded to life alert status, before we got on the bus to get back to the visitors center…
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I've done Colonial Williamsburg and Yorktown a couple years ago
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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I've done Colonial Williamsburg and Yorktown a couple years ago The gunshop is the coolest part at Williamsburg. And Jamestown is well worth a visit, the museum is very good, and those replica ships tiny. Yorktown, as observed, is likewise a small battlefield considering the momentous events there. In the Yorktown museum is this cannon, a British fieldpiece. Talk about provenance. It was dented by a French or American cannonball during the siege. The Marquis de Lafayette recognized this cannon while visiting the area 41 years after the fact.
"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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I figured you’d find that👍
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