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Posts: 8,238 Likes: 1
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I remember him from "Shooters" also, and have noticed the gradual change for the worse. I'll miss his knowledge, and half his humor.
I was surprised at some of the stuff he was getting away with.
It sucks, but Rick did the right thing.
Wish I would have saved his email addy.
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Joined: Dec 2002
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Campfire Regular
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Rick has said this is a family site with kids on board. If we can't have bouncing boobs in avatars then why in the world would he allow blatant racism.
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Campfire Tracker
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I think JJ nailed it. Past deeds don't excuse current behavior.
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,760
Campfire Outfitter
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Nothing personal happened between me and Larry. In fact, if I ever have the chance to buy him a drink or do him a service, I will gladly do it.
The thing about being a webmaster is that no matter what you do or how you do it, you always split the crowd.
To all of you who have been PMing me for months at every Larry wisecrack, let me just say that the guy contributed a LOT to this site, especially in the early years, but even recently. There was a time when the line of newbies into Larry's PM box asking advice on building rifles, INCLUDING ME, was long. Also, what Blake says about Larry being a straight shooter, is wholly true in my experience. Larry was an assett. I am not a happy camper.
To all of you who will defend him and overlook the nature of his posting recently, and of the TKD thread especially, then I submit you aren't being honest about the point we reached.
Freedom of speech has limits. Here, and everywhere. Someone has to draw the line here, and that someone, for better or for worse, is me. I drew that line, in a clear manner. I didn't draw it at Remingtons or Leupolds or someone hurt my feelers or something petty.
I drew it at continued, deliberate, overt racism. I should have never, ever tolerated it for the one day I did. That was a bad, bad mistake on my part, and to those who were offended, I apologize for not acting more quickly. That was a serious lapse of judgment on my part. Truth is, I didn't WANT to ban Larry.
The ironic thing is that now, after resisting pretty serious calls over the last 18 months to two years to nuke him (can I have a show of hands?), I'm going to be accused by some of being a happy trigger.
Guys, I had no other real move. Larry put me in a very difficult position.
He pushed too far.
Rick
Rick, et al, Not that my agreement or disagreement with your move means beans, but here goes... Personally I disagree with banning Larry. And I say that not liking too much he had to say in the way of opinions here in the fire forum. His tastes in guns didn't match mine either, but I know he knew his stuff on them too. And again thats all just different tastes. I had some PM conversations with him when some thread on religion got nasty. I found him to be a man that professed not to be a Christian, for which I can only say I wish that weren't true, but yet a man that would tell you that calmly and not try to argue it with you if you didn't push it with him...he was forthcoming, and generally polite and respectful to me... and to all unless you played in to his hand and took the many baits he left around the fire, some of which I agree were abrasive and/or off color. Ultimately, it was his offbeat sense of humor that made him love to poke fun and bait others on taboo subjects that cost him...other than that he was as others here have said...generally knowledgable, and a decent guy to converse with. Freedom of speech? That only applies to government censorship...period. This is Rick's site, and his business...he can nuke anyone or any topic he pleases, for any reason, without warning or explination. Bottom line...its Rick's business decision and I can't argue with that. Rick, some (NOT ALL) were too easily offended by Larry. Some had right and cause to be offended. I'd also say you excercised great patience and restraint, and I know it was a last resort, and you did what you had to do. The ignore button is easy to operate y'all. JMO, YMMV!
War Damn Eagle!
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Posts: 10,339 Likes: 4
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Bummer.........
I for one learnt a bunch from Stick, even if he was a bit of a hard read from time to time.
Black Cows Matter!
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...he was forthcoming, and generally polite and respectful to me... and to all unless you played in to his hand and took the many baits he left around the fire, some of which I agree were abrasive and/or off color. Ultimately, it was his offbeat sense of humor that made him love to poke fun and bait others on taboo subjects that cost him...other than that he was as others here have said...generally knowledgeable, and a decent guy to converse with. I think this is spot-on ... and well said at that ... If we're throwing our hats into the ring concerning whether or not we'd like to have Larry as a member here, I will go on record saying I wish he'd not been shown the door. Now, do I think he crossed the line with his racism/bigotry stuff that he recently posted ... Yes, I do ... but I'd also like to think that he was just going over the top, and not one who truly wishes to demean an entire group of people due to race or religion ... but then again, I can't (and won't) speak for anyone but me ... Oddly enough, even if Rick were to extend a "welcome back" invitation to Larry, I doubt if he'd accept. He just never came off to me as one that would want back in after what's transpired... I really wish that none of this ever went so far, and that all this had never happened. I would imagine that for some, this is truly a bitter-sweet circumstance. Personally, (and for most here I can only assume) that this is an almost total loss ...
Last edited by WGM; 02/05/07.
-WGM-
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He's gone folks.Let's just drop it.
WB.
"You set your own goals for success, and when you succeed it don't necessarily mean that you're going to be a big star or make a lot of money or anything. You'll feel it in your heart whether you've succeeded or not." - Roy Buchanan
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Campfire Outfitter
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i do not believe it was stick's ego growing. it was something else growing. cheaha and i have our theory. 13,000 enablers are too much of a good thing.
i will continue to pray for him and his ...
(elipses are a pun, for those in the know ...)
rick, i know it was WAY difficult for you.
mercy.
abiding in Him,
><>fish30ought6<><
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With regard as to what transpired I think this says it all.
What are the rules of conduct for the forum?
Registration as a user implies acceptance of the following terms and conditions:
- Participants shall not post any material that is likely to cause offence, protected by copyright, trademark or other proprietary right - without the express permission of the owner of such copyright - or that contains personal contact information, phone numbers or addresses.
- Participants may not use the forums to post or transmit advertisements or commercial solicitations of any kind.
- The forum Administrators and Moderators have the right to edit, censor, delete or otherwise modify any posted message.
- This web site does not verify or guarantee the accuracy of the material posted to the forums or bear any responsibility for any loss, damage, or other liabilities caused by any posted message.
Rick has shown unbelievable restraint in enforcing the forum rules of conduct IMO. I am very sorry about what happened to Stick. He is an extremely knowledgeable outdoorsman and his knowledge and experience will be sorely missed.
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Campfire Regular
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Nice job Rick in a tough situation.
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Posts: 17,254 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,254 Likes: 1 |
I am sorry the guy won't be around. He had a lot of "real world" knowledge to share, which I always appreciated, regardless of his strong opinions and blunt statements. When I saw the TKD thread, it was like watching a train wreck and I knew that the outcome was going to be bad. The thread kind of made me sick to my stomach. It's a shame that things went that far, a bad deal all around.
Now with even more aplomb
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dang, had no idea.... well stick, if your readin' this you will be missed.. cant speak for you or rick or whoever but you will be missed... mall ninja, i got that saved on my desktop  adios amigo.... woofer
"I would build one again, if it were not for my 350RM (grin)."
MtnHtr
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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What are the rules of conduct for the forum?
Registration as a user implies acceptance of the following terms and conditions:
- Participants shall not post any material that is likely to cause offence,
What causes offense to some is merely words to others........Blake
People sleep peaceable in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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What are the rules of conduct for the forum?
Registration as a user implies acceptance of the following terms and conditions:
- Participants shall not post any material that is likely to cause offence,
What causes offense to some is merely words to others........Blake
And therein lies the problem.....
That's ok, I'll ass shoot a dink.
Steelhead
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 17,147 Likes: 2 |
What causes offense to some is merely words to others........Blake
True. But in this case what causes offence is up to Rick to decide. It's his place, Rick's American Cafe Campfire (Like my use of the new strike through feature? 
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Not being a cyber-psychiatrist, I can't explain what happened.
But I do know it's going to be different around here and most don't know how different yet.
This is not a comment against Rick, it's about unintended consequences.
t
"Be sure you're right. Then go ahead." Fess Parker as Davy Crockett
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 11,282
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Campfire Outfitter
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Painless,
This is Rick's house.There is no "free speach" here,just as there is no "free speach" in YOUR house-if you don't like what someone says in your house,you give them the boot.
There's only one person to blame here,and it's Stick.He would have been gone long ago,on any other board.If Rick had let this go,then what would have happened next?
WB.
"You set your own goals for success, and when you succeed it don't necessarily mean that you're going to be a big star or make a lot of money or anything. You'll feel it in your heart whether you've succeeded or not." - Roy Buchanan
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Posts: 611
Campfire Regular
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I would rather sit at a real campfire, and enjoy shooting the real $hit with him and listening to the f-bombs and racial slurs and whatnot�because that�s real life and not some watered down politically correct horse pi$$. That�s the virtual world for ya�gotta please the puzzies and sometimes the players have to pay the price.
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You can bet Rick agonized over this.
He never takes banning lightly. Never.
Fox and some others were just trolls and grenade throwers and Rick went out of his way to allow them to stay.
How much harder was the decision when it was someone who had positively contributed so much in the past.
You can also bet Rick sent Stick some PM's before it came to that.
In this new server transition I , like most of you, got all of my old PM's back from years ago.
Some are from Stick, answering some questions in a short but helpfully manner giving me his expert information and good wishes.
I read the posts of the last week and one would not believe they were written by the same person.
I am afraid that perhaps they were not. Stick changed.
Sadly he was acting like a mean drunk. As if he wanted to leave with a bang.
Knowing Rick he was given every opportunity to step back from the edge. I am sorry he did not take it.
I will miss you stick, but you volunteered for this.
Lewis
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Campfire Tracker
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I think Chehea nailed the cause of Larry's change in another thread...  Don Larry's downward spiral has been painful to see, the last couple years. As Fish said, far to many enablers though the choice was his. I was at the old Shooters Site when Larry first appeared, in fact, I was one of the very few posters who would even talk to him without contempt.He went from an extremely knowledgeable, helpful poster to a raving sociopath in latter years. Pride and the bottle has taken it's toll. Sad to see a shooter fall. Here's hoping he recieves some help...
James
But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines, the commandments of men. Mt 15:9
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